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Post by rickyrosay on Sept 20, 2023 8:12:14 GMT -6
So I think we all know about Texas and Indiana when it comes to marching band state championships. But do other states have a similar type of unified championships like ISSMA and UIL? For Ohio is it OMEA or Mid-States? What about Michigan? Missouri? I'm assuming everything east of Ohio is some sort of USbands? Genuinely curious!
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Post by OldSchoolTrumpet on Sept 20, 2023 8:18:53 GMT -6
So I think we all know about Texas and Indiana when it comes to marching band state championships. But do other states have a similar type of unified championships like ISSMA and UIL? For Ohio is it OMEA or Mid-States? What about Michigan? Missouri? I'm assuming everything east of Ohio is some sort of USbands? Genuinely curious! Oklahoma has a State Championship, OBA. It will not surprise you to know that Broken Arrow has won the last 20 (6A champions) in a row!
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Post by rickyrosay on Sept 20, 2023 8:41:02 GMT -6
So I think we all know about Texas and Indiana when it comes to marching band state championships. But do other states have a similar type of unified championships like ISSMA and UIL? For Ohio is it OMEA or Mid-States? What about Michigan? Missouri? I'm assuming everything east of Ohio is some sort of USbands? Genuinely curious! Oklahoma has a State Championship, OBA. It will not surprise you to know that Broken Arrow has won the last 20 (6A champions) in a row! I am shocked. This is my shocked face
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Post by philodemus on Sept 20, 2023 9:12:55 GMT -6
Shocked and appalled you were not already aware of the third most important State Championship series, the glorious SMBC of the beautiful Commonwealth of Kentucky.
It’s kind of a big deal.
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Post by hewhowaits on Sept 20, 2023 9:17:07 GMT -6
In Ohio, there is no unified system.
OMEA has a qualification system where all bands that earn a top rating at events throughout the season are invited to participate in "State Finals." This is not a competition in the true sense of the word as it is held at multiple sites over multiple days and no overall champion or champion per class is named.
MSBA is a consortium of bands in Southwest Ohio, Northern Kentucky, and Southeast Indiana. Any band that competes in or hosts an event during the season is entitled to register for MSBA championships. The five classes (based on number of musicians performing) each have a separate championship (typically) held on the first Saturday of November. Full placement and caption awards are announced for each class.
Some Ohio MSBA bands participate in OMEA, most do not. Most Kentucky and Indiana MSBA bands participate in KMEA and ISSMA.
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Post by dbalash on Sept 20, 2023 9:26:18 GMT -6
Illinois over here like:
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Post by boahistorybuff on Sept 20, 2023 11:45:54 GMT -6
For Michigan, the Michigan Competing Band Assciation (MCBA) is the circuit that runs the state championships. MCBA organized in the 1970s as more bands began a competitive corps style marching program. The circuit conducted the first state championships in 1980 and has held a state championship every year since (with the exception of 2020 when Covid cancelled the season).
States other than Michigan, Indiana and Texas that have organized state championships that I know of include: New York (the New York Field Band Conference has a held state championships all the back into the early 70s), South Carolina (the state championships also goes back many decades), Kentucky, Oklahoma, Louisiana, Utah, Florida, California (through the Western Band Association), Minnesota, Pennsylvania, and Mississippi.
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Post by statechamp1239 on Sept 20, 2023 12:24:48 GMT -6
So I think we all know about Texas and Indiana when it comes to marching band state championships. But do other states have a similar type of unified championships like ISSMA and UIL? For Ohio is it OMEA or Mid-States? What about Michigan? Missouri? I'm assuming everything east of Ohio is some sort of USbands? Genuinely curious! If you want insight in variety of States Championships you can go to the history thread that has information on many Championships throughout most of states thanks to boahistorybuff, hawknate14, hewhowaits, and more. Wyoming has a State Championships which is lesser known than most of them. It's usually located in an indoor arena and uses a Superior to Good rating system with a good number of bands competing. For Example: Wyoming 2022 State Marching Festival
Casper, WY: Ford Wyoming Center Superior: Cheyenne East, WY (Best M, Marching, Winds, CG) Superior: Kelly Walsh, WY (Best M, Winds, Marching, CG and Perc) Superior: Sheridan, WY (Best M, Marching and Winds) Superior: Cheyenne South, WY (Best M, Winds, Marching) Perc) Superior: Riverton, WY (Best Marching) Superior: Thunder Basin, WY (Best Marching) Superior: Wheatland WY (Best Marching) Superior: Douglas, WY etc. Another States Championships that's not that well known and isn't in the history thread is West Virginia. The West Virginia Department of Arts, Culture, and History fund the events and State Championships, and provides a prize money for bands with the most accumulative points that a school earn from their overall placement in each competition before the State Championships so placing 1st earns 5pts., 2nd earns 4pts., 3rd earns 3pts., 4th earns 2pts., and 5th earns 1pt. 1st place - $3,250 2nd place - $2K 3rd place - $1K 4th place - $750 5th place - $500 2022 Governor's Cups Point Results: Cabell Midland High School 48 Hurricane High School 18 Greenbrier East High School 17 Philip Barbour High School 17 Capital High School 17
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Post by macwinlin on Sept 20, 2023 13:35:51 GMT -6
So I think we all know about Texas and Indiana when it comes to marching band state championships. But do other states have a similar type of unified championships like ISSMA and UIL? For Ohio is it OMEA or Mid-States? What about Michigan? Missouri? I'm assuming everything east of Ohio is some sort of USbands? Genuinely curious! While Oklahoma does have Oklahoma Bandmasters Association (OBA) which is widely known as the state championship contest, the actual state contests tied to the schools are run by OSSAA. OSSAA (think UIL) is the governing body of school activities in Oklahoma, and they are responsible for the classification of schools based on enrollment. If you want to be involved in band or other extracurriculars, even if your group doesn't participate in their contests, you have to register for OSSAA-mandated drug tests and physicals. The contests they run are fairly old-school and only assign ratings, so many groups have opted out in recent years. They're also in the middle of the school day.
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Post by MarchingBand4Life on Sept 20, 2023 14:01:22 GMT -6
In Minnesota, state championships are part of Youth in Music, held in early October at USBank Stadium. YIM is not limited to MN bands though. Bands from WI, IA, MO and the Dakota's also join in.
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Post by statechamp1239 on Sept 20, 2023 14:43:20 GMT -6
I'm assuming everything east of Ohio is some sort of USbands? Genuinely curious! I'm nerding out. But USBands was one of the most popular circuits here in the Northeast and Mid-Atlantic that has provide a state championship but there are some state creating their own circuit due to not liking USBands system over the years. - Thanks to srv1084 with his beautifully written history on EMBC and CT, and I suggest everyone read it. It's amazing. hornrank.proboards.com/post/59685 . Here. EMBC did provide a Connecticut States until more outside band started competing, so they moved to championing each state. Same as USBands providing a New England State that champions each band from different state in each Group/Class. So for Rhode Island, Maine if Westbrook HS comes and Connecticut it's their only State performance.
- Massachusetts has MICCA Festival state finals which I don't know that much, but they use a star rating system.
- New York has New York State Field Band Conference, but USBands also does provide a States that mainly pull Long Island bands. However, USBands NY States is nowhere near the size as NYSFBC.
- The Tournament of Bands circuit provided Maryland their first States in the late 1980s which exploded in participants in the 90s until TOB stopped in 2003 as USSBA Maryland States grew in power. In 2019 many MD directors was tired of non Mayland circuits having such a hold in Maryland and decided to make the MMBA (Maryland Marching Band Association) to provide their unified championships.
- Tournament of Bands I believe is the only circuit that has a Delaware States Championships that's usually paired up with Maryland since the Delaware competitive band scene is getting smaller and smaller every decade.
However, New Jersey did have their own State Championships provided by NJMEA which was popular in 60s to 80s which Hammonton HS dominated for a portion of a time, but slowly decrease in bands over time unfortunately I don't know why, so NJMEA moved on to focus on a huge festival/showband bands participant in the fall, and in the spring jazz/concert/symphonic bands. But many organizations have held a NJ State Championships like Cavalcade of Bands in 2021, USBands in 2002, and Tournament of Bands in 2011. USSBA being the most popular that had to most bands competing with 100+ bands, which was the most successful out all of the USBands State Championships. We even had out of state bands compete for example Baldwinsville Central (NY) who got last place in 2013 and more, but in 2020 a bunch New Jersey band directors decided to design NJMBDA State Championships that's now the only New Jersey State-based circuit which isn't helping USBands NJ States numbers.
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Post by realjsnacks on Sept 20, 2023 15:54:49 GMT -6
So I think we all know about Texas and Indiana when it comes to marching band state championships. But do other states have a similar type of unified championships like ISSMA and UIL? For Ohio is it OMEA or Mid-States? What about Michigan? Missouri? I'm assuming everything east of Ohio is some sort of USbands? Genuinely curious! While Oklahoma does have Oklahoma Bandmasters Association (OBA) which is widely known as the state championship contest, the actual state contests tied to the schools are run by OSSAA. OSSAA (think UIL) is the governing body of school activities in Oklahoma, and they are responsible for the classification of schools based on enrollment. If you want to be involved in band or other extracurriculars, even if your group doesn't participate in their contests, you have to register for OSSAA-mandated drug tests and physicals. The contests they run are fairly old-school and only assign ratings, so many groups have opted out in recent years. They're also in the middle of the school day. Additionally, OBA also uses OSSAA classifications to determine competing classes for the OBA contests. Some schools that compete in OBA will only compete in OSSAA during concert season (like mine when I marched), which hosts district, regional, and state contests to assign ratings onstage and in sightreading. Get I's during the fall and in the spring, and you get the Sweepstakes award. However as said before, most default to OBA as the de facto and (rightly) superior marching circuit, with most smaller schools opting for OSSAA instead due to financial reasons. Fun fact: the only music contest that OSSAA even assigns placements and scores for is in jazz band.
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Post by jakeymam12 on Sept 20, 2023 15:56:34 GMT -6
Utah has their state championships, the UMEA Red Rocks State championships the same weekend as BOA St. George. Usually the day before. This is a reason to why so many Utah bands participate in BOA St. George. Each class has their own champion, but divisions that were split into 2 (5A and 6A) would join back together to compete as one. The scholastic champions were still announced and awarded when their scores and placements were announced, but would usually end up not taking titles for the entire division. I’ve been told however that this year they aren’t going to combine scholastic and open classes at Red Rocks, which is good for some bands and not so much for others depending on how you look at it.
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Post by ilikeguard on Sept 20, 2023 16:38:22 GMT -6
MSMA in Missouri is in its second year of existence! There are quite a few more bands participating this year, but it’s still missing most of the top groups (Lindbergh, Timberland, Rockwood Summit, Hickman, Blue Springs South, Nixa, Fort Zumwalt North, Grain Valley, Camdenton, and obviously Blue Springs). Kickapoo is attending and is a shoo-in to win 5A this year, but we’d probably see an OBA situation should the rest attend with Blue Springs winning every year they attend. The others I mentioned are all fairly close, so it would be a pretty fun competition to watch! I’m hoping it gets off the ground soon.
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Post by rickyrosay on Sept 21, 2023 7:14:02 GMT -6
This is all crazy cool to see and hear! I don't know how many of these championships have live streaming, but that's something that would be neat. Obviously Grand Nationals is probably the place you get your "premiere" talent for the most part. And I mean that not just the top 12-15 groups (Which I do think 15 groups these days are probably deserving of being a finalist, wgi style) but the top end of each class individually is probably some of the best of what you're going to see around the country with bands of a similar make up. But, if FLO or Box5 wants to hire another couple hundred people and take my $32 to stream a state finals for every state that has one? I would not be mad about it. Flo and Box might be mad because my $32 wouldn't come close to covering any cost, but its not about you FLO!
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charredbrown
Senior Member
Morton Alum, currently teaching band at Lutheran North High School in MI
Posts: 87
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Post by charredbrown on Sept 21, 2023 8:37:16 GMT -6
Illinois over here like: Yeeeaaaaahhhhhhh... :/ Someday, maybe! probably not
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Post by dbalash on Sept 21, 2023 8:51:00 GMT -6
Illinois over here like: Yeeeaaaaahhhhhhh... :/ Someday, maybe! probably notWell hell, we can't even agree on standard sheets and judge numbers, so.... yeah. About that.
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Post by stlbanddad on Sept 21, 2023 13:52:02 GMT -6
Illinois over here like: So when bands call themselves "Illinois State Champions" because they win the "Illinois State Marching Band Championships" that is named that only because it is held at Illinois State University... those don't count, huh? Seriously - that competition needs a new name so this madness stops.
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Post by marimba11 on Sept 21, 2023 21:03:44 GMT -6
South Carolina has had a state championship circuit since at least the 70s if not longer. There are 5 different classes with something close to 150 high schools that participate.
While state circuits can include a lot of politics and drama, ultimately judges are brought from around the country now and the healthy part of instate competition definitely breeds success. At the end of the day I wish more states had them.
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Post by dbbandalum on Sept 21, 2023 21:12:56 GMT -6
Tennessee doesn`t have a unified state championship. There are 2 different circuits that both claim to be the TN state championships, but none of the top schools besides Elizabethton attend either of them. The Contest of Champions in Murfreesboro is often regarded as the unofficial state championship of TN since that`s where most of the top TN bands attend. But that contest, until recently, was dominated by Kentucky bands.
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Post by dbalash on Sept 22, 2023 8:08:27 GMT -6
Illinois over here like: So when bands call themselves "Illinois State Champions" because they win the "Illinois State Marching Band Championships" that is named that only because it is held at Illinois State University... those don't count, huh? Seriously - that competition needs a new name so this madness stops. Well, IHSA has some confangled "music sweepstakes" state championship that's some combination of solo/ensemble and organizational performances that no one begins to understand that some bands claim as well. ISU-Illinois State Marching Band Championships IMBC - Illini Marching Band Championships Redbird Marching Band Championships doesn't have the same ring to it.
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Post by philodemus on Sept 22, 2023 8:46:28 GMT -6
So, why don't directors in states such as Illinois or Tennessee copy the example of Missouri? Form a group of like-minded folks and begin the process.
I mean, I suspect I know the answer, but I wanted to throw out the opportunity for someone to point out a good, rational argument against State Championships that I haven't thought of.
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Post by marimba11 on Sept 22, 2023 10:38:04 GMT -6
I think part of the reason Texas is so good is that UIL is so comprehensive. I know there are many thoughts on UIL, but I think that and their large school sizes have helped them tremendously. I forget if it is area or region but whatever one comes before state I think that one is great for good competitive culture
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Post by boahistorybuff on Sept 22, 2023 10:54:39 GMT -6
I dont know the answer as to why not all states have a sanctioned state championships. I can tell you what happened with MCBA back in the 1980s. MCBA (or MCBDA) as it was known back then organized the flights (Michigan's version of Class or Divisions) based on band size as opposed to school size. With the exception of Wyoming Park and Hartford, a lot of the bands on the west side of Michigan did not like that, they wanted a classification system based on school size and not band size. I think one of the reasons is that back in those days, the schools on the west side tended to be smaller, yet many of them fielded a relatively large band.
So MCBDA was mostly composed of bands from the east side of the state and that is also where all of the MCBDA competitions were held. In fact I believe a loosely organized competitive circuit had been formed on the west side. In 1989, an emerging west side power by the name of Jenison came over to the east side and attended the state championships. This seemed to really begin discussions of a more integrated MCBDA circuit between bands on the two sides of the state.
In 1990 and 1991 MCBDA began the efforts to appease bands from both sides of the state. What they did is that they organized the Flights based on school size instead of band size which appeased the west side bands. They also allowed bands from smaller school to compete in a higher flight if they so chose, which appeased some of the east side bands that came from a little smaller schools but wanted to be in a more competitive Flight (like Flushing and Durand).
What this did is brought a lot of emerging band program from the west side (like Mona Shores and Reeths-Puffer in addition to Jenison) into the MCBA circuit. MCBA also started hosting competitions on the west side of the state. What this did is it allowed the circuit to grow into what it is today.
I think had there not been that willingness to compromise in the early 90s, Michigan could have had two separate circuits and no true state champion. Thankfully that did not happen because I think Michigan bands are better having just the one circuit as it has increased the level of competition.
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Post by dbalash on Sept 22, 2023 10:56:57 GMT -6
So, why don't directors in states such as Illinois or Tennessee copy the example of Missouri? Form a group of like-minded folks and begin the process. I mean, I suspect I know the answer, but I wanted to throw out the opportunity for someone to point out a good, rational argument against State Championships that I haven't thought of. Probably partially an argument of band size vs. school size, sheets, judges, and the fact that some of these bands go out once or twice a year, and some of the bands in the state go out 6-7. IHSA still views marching band as an "emerging sport", but there's currently only 6 bands listed, 2 of which do not compete. There was an ad hoc committee allegedly formed around 2012 by the IHSA that was going to survey the member schools about a state series, but nothing ever came of that. I'd love for something to happen, but there's so many established competitions in Illinois that are not going to want to give up the money they get from hosting because there's a state series.
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Post by 78haworth on Sept 22, 2023 11:35:14 GMT -6
Tennessee doesn`t have a unified state championship. There are 2 different circuits that both claim to be the TN state championships, but none of the top schools besides Elizabethton attend either of them. The Contest of Champions in Murfreesboro is often regarded as the unofficial state championship of TN since that`s where most of the top TN bands attend. But that contest, until recently, was dominated by Kentucky bands. Contest of Champions awards the Tennessee governor's cup AND Kentucky gives a governor's cup to the highest placing band for each state. COC is held by Middle Tennessee State University (MTSU) and dates back to 1962!
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Post by dbbandalum on Sept 23, 2023 5:58:37 GMT -6
The only way a true state championship would be created in TN is if the TSSAA (Tennessee high school sports association) creates one. That is the only organization that could create enough pull to have all the top schools competing. The other TN circuits just don't have enough reputation. Heck I didn't even know they existed until Elizabethton started attending one of them.
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Post by philodemus on Sept 23, 2023 6:16:58 GMT -6
I'd love for something to happen, but there's so many established competitions in Illinois that are not going to want to give up the money they get from hosting because there's a state series. So, just spitballing ideas... Why not offer something to the established contests as an incentive to be on board? Go to the 2 big 'state championships' and say, "We're going to rotate: this year one of you gets 1, 3, and 5A, the other gets 2, 4, & 6. Next year we flip. You are guaranteed to host a big chunk of groups every year because you are a part of this system, this is good for you." Then the week after you have State Final in the dome in STL. Is it weird to have a State Championship outside the State? A bit, but come on, you can see Illinois from the Dome, and now the best groups in the state get to have their last run inside and in tune.
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Post by trumpette123 on Sept 25, 2023 22:03:09 GMT -6
MSMA in Missouri is in its second year of existence! There are quite a few more bands participating this year, but it’s still missing most of the top groups (Lindbergh, Timberland, Rockwood Summit, Hickman, Blue Springs South, Nixa, Fort Zumwalt North, Grain Valley, Camdenton, and obviously Blue Springs). Kickapoo is attending and is a shoo-in to win 5A this year, but we’d probably see an OBA situation should the rest attend with Blue Springs winning every year they attend. The others I mentioned are all fairly close, so it would be a pretty fun competition to watch! I’m hoping it gets off the ground soon. That’s super exciting! I had no idea they finally created a “circuit.” I was always jealous of Indiana and Texas circuits. While I was at blue springs we pretty much only went to BOA stuff. We went to state at mizzou senior year. I wish we had done more local stuff. I was hoping to watch South and BS at BSS this past weekend but it got rained out.
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Post by jeremiah on Sept 26, 2023 16:08:51 GMT -6
It's actually worse than that in Tennessee. I can think of 5 different contests that have at various points in times claimed to offer a state championship:
—MTSU Contest of Champions —Memphis Bandmasters —APSU's Governor's Own Marching Contest —"Div II" State Championships (This one is especially strange because sports in Tennessee are classified as Div. 1 which is public schools or private schools that don't offer scholarships and Div. 2 is private schools that do offer scholarships, but the Div II state marching championships tends to just be smaller public school bands) —USBands TN Championships in Chattanooga which is now defunct
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