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Post by hewhowaits on Oct 17, 2021 15:30:04 GMT -6
DeSoto Central with VPI of 17.8 in prelims certainly raises an eyebrow for me, especially given their 15.7 in finals.
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Post by rainbowhats on Oct 17, 2021 15:59:32 GMT -6
There may perhaps be significant reason for that delay What would that reason be? Heard a rumor some (supposed) penalties with Byrnes getting on the field/Wando off and Mill Creek off/Harrison on were being discussed (not enough to change rankings though apparently). Harrison blocked Mill Creek from coming off the field at finals, and the same traffic happened with Wando/Byrnes
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Post by jeremiah on Oct 17, 2021 16:40:11 GMT -6
What would that reason be? Heard a rumor some (supposed) penalties with Byrnes getting on the field/Wando off and Mill Creek off/Harrison on were being discussed (not enough to change rankings though apparently). Harrison blocked Mill Creek from coming off the field at finals, and the same traffic happened with Wando/Byrnes There were no penalties on the recap.
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Post by jeremiah on Oct 17, 2021 16:44:32 GMT -6
DeSoto Central with VPI of 17.8 in prelims certainly raises an eyebrow for me, especially given their 15.7 in finals. If the chief judge was anyone other than Richard Saucedo, I would question the accuracy of the numbers. But as someone who has personally witnessed Richard ask a judge to reconsider their number or range more than once, I have no doubt that number is accurate. Apparently both field judges were just in all the right spots during DeSoto Central's prelims performance because they both gave incredibly high numbers.
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Post by supersound on Oct 17, 2021 16:53:18 GMT -6
What would that reason be? Heard a rumor some (supposed) penalties with Byrnes getting on the field/Wando off and Mill Creek off/Harrison on were being discussed (not enough to change rankings though apparently). Harrison blocked Mill Creek from coming off the field at finals, and the same traffic happened with Wando/Byrnes Honestly I’d imagine it was chalked up to issues understanding venue procedures. Nothing penalty worthy on either bands end.
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Post by supersound on Oct 17, 2021 16:53:47 GMT -6
DeSoto Central with VPI of 17.8 in prelims certainly raises an eyebrow for me, especially given their 15.7 in finals. If the chief judge was anyone other than Richard Saucedo, I would question the accuracy of the numbers. But as someone who has personally witnessed Richard ask a judge to reconsider their number or range more than once, I have no doubt that number is accurate. Apparently both field judges were just in all the right spots during DeSoto Central's prelims performance because they both gave incredibly high numbers. Sometimes things just line up really nicely for a band. This was one of those times.
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Post by rainbowhats on Oct 17, 2021 16:56:44 GMT -6
Heard a rumor some (supposed) penalties with Byrnes getting on the field/Wando off and Mill Creek off/Harrison on were being discussed (not enough to change rankings though apparently). Harrison blocked Mill Creek from coming off the field at finals, and the same traffic happened with Wando/Byrnes There were no penalties on the recap. saw that, which I thought was strange, because I was by the front side 1 exit where Mill Creek/Harrison were and their band was not off the field when the judge called time, and they still had tarps out.
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Post by thewho on Oct 17, 2021 16:56:45 GMT -6
Heard a rumor some (supposed) penalties with Byrnes getting on the field/Wando off and Mill Creek off/Harrison on were being discussed (not enough to change rankings though apparently). Harrison blocked Mill Creek from coming off the field at finals, and the same traffic happened with Wando/Byrnes Honestly I’d imagine it was chalked up to issues understanding venue procedures. Nothing penalty worthy on either bands end. Exactly. There's been many cases before where a band just struggles to get off and end up interfering with the flow. I love Toledo and the UofT stadium, but having only one entrance for major props and it also being the exit meant a lot of bands struggled with getting on the field. In these cases, any delays are understandable and it's made clear that penalties won't be incurred.
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Post by hewhowaits on Oct 17, 2021 16:57:04 GMT -6
DeSoto Central with VPI of 17.8 in prelims certainly raises an eyebrow for me, especially given their 15.7 in finals. If the chief judge was anyone other than Richard Saucedo, I would question the accuracy of the numbers. But as someone who has personally witnessed Richard ask a judge to reconsider their number or range more than once, I have no doubt that number is accurate. Apparently both field judges were just in all the right spots during DeSoto Central's prelims performance because they both gave incredibly high numbers. A fair assessment. I once worked in the press box area at a Bowling Green Regional and heard him ask three different judges about the number they assigned a particular band (each one a different band).
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Post by supersound on Oct 17, 2021 16:58:33 GMT -6
If the chief judge was anyone other than Richard Saucedo, I would question the accuracy of the numbers. But as someone who has personally witnessed Richard ask a judge to reconsider their number or range more than once, I have no doubt that number is accurate. Apparently both field judges were just in all the right spots during DeSoto Central's prelims performance because they both gave incredibly high numbers. A fair assessment. I once worked in the press box area at a Bowling Green Regional and heard him ask three different judges about the number they assigned a particular band (each one a different band). This might just be me but I don’t think I’ve seen Saucedo on many Texan regional panels. Any reason why that might be?
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Post by hewhowaits on Oct 17, 2021 17:00:22 GMT -6
There were no penalties on the recap. saw that, which I thought was strange, because I was by the front side 1 exit where Mill Creek/Harrison were and their band was not off the field when the judge called time, and they still had tarps out. Penalties are generally only assessed for something like this if the infraction causes a delay in the contest. At one Grand Nationals, Mason incurred a one point penalty in prelims due to the delays they created by not getting their props out of the way in the tunnel and slowing down access for other bands. The contest director had no choice but to assess a penalty because those delays included stopping bands, front ensembles, and props on an icy ramp.
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Post by supersound on Oct 17, 2021 17:02:52 GMT -6
saw that, which I thought was strange, because I was by the front side 1 exit where Mill Creek/Harrison were and their band was not off the field when the judge called time, and they still had tarps out. Penalties are generally only assessed for something like this if the infraction causes a delay in the contest. At one Grand Nationals, Mason incurred a one point penalty in prelims due to the delays they created by not getting their props out of the way in the tunnel and slowing down access for other bands. The contest director had no choice but to assess a penalty because those delays included stopping bands, front ensembles, and props on an icy ramp. A fun fact I always enjoy mentioning when we discuss penalties is when groups *intentionally* take penalties, rare but it happens. See L.D. Bell 2007 national prelims and semifinals crossing the performance boundaries and taking a .1 penalty on purpose.
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Post by marchingmahem on Oct 17, 2021 17:20:45 GMT -6
Penalties are generally only assessed for something like this if the infraction causes a delay in the contest. At one Grand Nationals, Mason incurred a one point penalty in prelims due to the delays they created by not getting their props out of the way in the tunnel and slowing down access for other bands. The contest director had no choice but to assess a penalty because those delays included stopping bands, front ensembles, and props on an icy ramp. A fun fact I always enjoy mentioning when we discuss penalties is when groups *intentionally* take penalties, rare but it happens. See L.D. Bell 2007 national prelims and semifinals crossing the performance boundaries and taking a .1 penalty on purpose. Why did they cross the boundary? Was it apart of their drill?
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Post by Allohak on Oct 17, 2021 19:01:33 GMT -6
A fun fact I always enjoy mentioning when we discuss penalties is when groups *intentionally* take penalties, rare but it happens. See L.D. Bell 2007 national prelims and semifinals crossing the performance boundaries and taking a .1 penalty on purpose. Why did they cross the boundary? Was it apart of their drill? It was having their child actor soloist on the DM podium, IIRC? What they had the soloist do in finals was different and did not cross any boundaries
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Post by jeremiah on Oct 17, 2021 19:05:40 GMT -6
A fair assessment. I once worked in the press box area at a Bowling Green Regional and heard him ask three different judges about the number they assigned a particular band (each one a different band). This might just be me but I don’t think I’ve seen Saucedo on many Texan regional panels. Any reason why that might be? Typically, Gary Markham went to whatever the biggest or most competitive show of the weekend was and then Saucedo was at the other show. This year, we’re seeing a much bigger variety of individuals playing the chief judge role since Markham took a step back from all the travel. But Saucedo does still seem to be at “the other show” more often than not. Perhaps it’s because of groups he consults or writes for? You won’t see him judging at Indy Super or Grand Nats because he still writes and arranges Carmel’s music, but there may be other groups he works with that limit what shows he can judge.
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Post by marimba11 on Oct 17, 2021 19:07:35 GMT -6
What would that reason be? Heard a rumor some (supposed) penalties with Byrnes getting on the field/Wando off and Mill Creek off/Harrison on were being discussed (not enough to change rankings though apparently). Harrison blocked Mill Creek from coming off the field at finals, and the same traffic happened with Wando/Byrnes Ohh is that what happened… I noticed in prelims Byrnes started about two minutes late, and then there was that really awkward time between the announcements and the start of the show
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Post by supersound on Oct 17, 2021 21:02:11 GMT -6
Why did they cross the boundary? Was it apart of their drill? It was having their child actor soloist on the DM podium, IIRC? What they had the soloist do in finals was different and did not cross any boundaries I don’t think they had the child on the podium for both prelims and semis. I think during semis she just simply crossed the front boundary? Not sure my memory is messing with me.
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Post by Allohak on Oct 17, 2021 21:04:49 GMT -6
It was having their child actor soloist on the DM podium, IIRC? What they had the soloist do in finals was different and did not cross any boundaries I don’t think they had the child on the podium for both prelims and semis. I think during semis she just simply crossed the front boundary? Not sure my memory is messing with me. To be fair to both of us, this was 14 years ago and I'm certain we've both seen A LOT of band shows since
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Post by iloveband on Oct 18, 2021 3:14:09 GMT -6
Heard a rumor some (supposed) penalties with Byrnes getting on the field/Wando off and Mill Creek off/Harrison on were being discussed (not enough to change rankings though apparently). Harrison blocked Mill Creek from coming off the field at finals, and the same traffic happened with Wando/Byrnes Ohh is that what happened… I noticed in prelims Byrnes started about two minutes late, and then there was that really awkward time between the announcements and the start of the show That was Byrnes following DB in prelims. In Finals they followed Wando. Both times it was a mess getting one big band off and another big band on.
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