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Post by regimember on Oct 11, 2023 18:27:46 GMT -6
In 2021 Campbell Co preformed Stranded, link below. In 2023 PTHS, Texas school, is preforming the same show just with diffrent visuals, link below. Who did it better? Are there any more major offenders of this? Not to put them on blast just curious. This is much much much more common than you think. Designers have so many groups and only so many ideas. Recycling honestly keeps this sport of the arts alive. |
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Post by cheesemcdiddlesworth on Oct 11, 2023 18:28:20 GMT -6
In 2021 Campbell Co preformed Stranded, link below. In 2023 PTHS, Texas school, is preforming the same show just with diffrent visuals, link below. Who did it better? Are there any more major offenders of this? Not to put them on blast just curious. What is wrong with bands doing similar or even the same show? |
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Post by yayband914 on Oct 11, 2023 18:31:46 GMT -6
Can we please just… not with these kinds of posts/comments? I have seen a few comments like this recently, and I know they are made innocuously, but they also can come across as condescending to programs just wanting to perform a marching band show. They are hardly “offenders.”
James Earl Rudder is performing Bassett’s 2022 show this year.
Air Academy is performing Hendrickson’s 2022 show this year.
Pine Tree is performing Campbell County’s 2021 show this year.
…to name just a few from this season alone.
These bands are not “copying” other bands. They are purchasing a show that has already been designed, at a much cheaper price than designing a show from scratch.
Hundreds, maybe even thousands, of band programs operate in this way, and it is not a new phenomenon. There is never any malicious intent or underhandedness when a band program performs a show another band has already performed.
Incidentally, I noticed last season that Olympia H.S. from Florida also performed this show upon watching BOA Orlando (I had remembered this show from one of the 2021 Ohio regionals). I’m sure it’s been performed by even a couple more!
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Post by paddy on Oct 11, 2023 19:14:07 GMT -6
Can we please just… not with these kinds of posts/comments? I have seen a few comments like this recently, and I know they are made innocuously, but they also can come across as condescending to programs just wanting to perform a marching band show. They are hardly “offenders.” James Earl Rudder is performing Bassett’s 2022 show this year. Air Academy is performing Hendrickson’s 2022 show this year. Pine Tree is performing Campbell County’s 2021 show this year. …to name just a few from this season alone. These bands are not “copying” other bands. They are purchasing a show that has already been designed, at a much cheaper price than designing a show from scratch. Hundreds, maybe even thousands, of band programs operate in this way, and it is not a new phenomenon. There is never any malicious intent or underhandedness when a band program performs a show another band has already performed. Incidentally, I noticed last season that Olympia H.S. from Florida also performed this show upon watching BOA Orlando (I had remembered this show from one of the 2021 Ohio regionals). I’m sure it’s been performed by even a couple more! I already made this post. You’re just copying it. |
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Post by regimember on Oct 11, 2023 19:21:23 GMT -6
Can we please just… not with these kinds of posts/comments? I have seen a few comments like this recently, and I know they are made innocuously, but they also can come across as condescending to programs just wanting to perform a marching band show. They are hardly “offenders.” James Earl Rudder is performing Bassett’s 2022 show this year. Air Academy is performing Hendrickson’s 2022 show this year. Pine Tree is performing Campbell County’s 2021 show this year. …to name just a few from this season alone. These bands are not “copying” other bands. They are purchasing a show that has already been designed, at a much cheaper price than designing a show from scratch. Hundreds, maybe even thousands, of band programs operate in this way, and it is not a new phenomenon. There is never any malicious intent or underhandedness when a band program performs a show another band has already performed. Incidentally, I noticed last season that Olympia H.S. from Florida also performed this show upon watching BOA Orlando (I had remembered this show from one of the 2021 Ohio regionals). I’m sure it’s been performed by even a couple more! Also going to plug WGI... Indoor Percussion and Winter Guard are basically dominated by recycled shows as each year the majority of the shows have been performed many times by multiple groups. Of course each group tailors a show to be more fitting and suitable for the program and level of performers, as arrangements can range from higher to lower levels of difficulty yet be of the same repertoire and material. |
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Post by philodemus on Oct 11, 2023 19:49:36 GMT -6
Everything is a remix.
There’s nothing new under the Sun.
But that said, a new twist on an old idea is still possible, and always welcome.
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Post by ilikeguard on Oct 11, 2023 19:51:05 GMT -6
I think it’s fun pointing out which bands have bought shows/arrangements/props from other bands, but I agree that the word “copying” isn’t in good faith. Purchasing elements that have already been used in a performance before doesn’t come with the hard work included any more than buying a used car comes with a chauffeur. All of the credit belongs to the kids performing the show they’ve been given.
Now…I have and will call out excessive recycling by designers. My moral code with this is that I won’t pick on any decisions made by the performers, but (most) adults are fair game.
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Post by ilikeguard on Oct 11, 2023 19:52:15 GMT -6
Air Academy is performing Hendrickson’s 2022 show this year. I love Air Academy and I love this show…say less |
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Post by boahistorybuff on Oct 12, 2023 4:23:29 GMT -6
I think the idea is to offer a slightly different take on a classic piece of music or drill design. Given that this is an educational experience, some bands just want to give their kids the opportunity to perform a classic show. High school bands have taken a lot of material from DCI over the years. I also come from the era when theme based shows were taking root and a lot of bands did similar shows as the endless possibilities of how to construct a show around a theme were still being cultivated. It was always interesting to see different bands do the same or similar shows back then. Common shows back then (and in many cases still common today) were West Side Story, the Sound of Music, Phantom of the Opera, Jesus Christ Superstar, Henry V, Spartacus, Les Misérables, The Wind and the Lion, Candide, Gloria, Cats, Music of Copeland (Appalachian Spring), Fiddler on the Roof, (Oz) Somewhere Over the Rainbow, Disney, Music of Barber, Music of Stravinsky, Rocky Point Holiday, Pines of Rome, Gates of Kiev, New World Symphony, Holst the Planets, etc, etc, etc.
While these shows often have had a lot of similarities, they have also had differences. "Recycled" music and drill material have always been a part of the marching arts. I like that. I like seeing bands do a similar show as another band but put a unique/different spin on it.
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Post by paddy on Oct 12, 2023 5:54:55 GMT -6
I think the idea is to offer a slightly different take on a classic piece of music or drill design. Given that this is an educational experience, some bands just want to give their kids the opportunity to perform a classic show. High school bands have taken a lot of material from DCI over the years. I also come from the era when theme based shows were taking root and a lot of bands did similar shows as the endless possibilities of how to construct a show around a theme were still being cultivated. It was always interesting to see different bands do the same or similar shows back then. Common shows back then (and in many cases still common today) were West Side Story, the Sound of Music, Phantom of the Opera, Jesus Christ Superstar, Henry V, Spartacus, Les Misérables, The Wind and the Lion, Candide, Gloria, Cats, Music of Copeland (Appalachian Spring), Fiddler on the Roof, (Oz) Somewhere Over the Rainbow, Disney, Music of Barber, Music of Stravinsky, Rocky Point Holiday, Pines of Rome, Gates of Kiev, New World Symphony, Holst the Planets, etc, etc, etc. While these shows often have had a lot of similarities, they have also had differences. "Recycled" music and drill material have always been a part of the marching arts. I like that. I like seeing bands do a similar show as another band but put a unique/different spin on it. Robin Hood, Prince of Thieves says hello. In the early 90s for a couple of years there were at least a dozen bands who used this movie as source music in Indiana. |
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Post by marimba11 on Oct 12, 2023 6:24:20 GMT -6
Looks like River Bluff SC is doing Cedar Park’s mirror mirror show from last year
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Post by ohbandfan on Oct 12, 2023 9:06:15 GMT -6
I never noticed until a month or so ago, but Broken Arrow 2012 and Mason 2016 are very similar dark, apocalyptic, Barber inspired shows. Also, I feel like BA 2021 is a new, modern revamp of their 2011 show. It’s crazy how many similarities you notice if you follow the activity long enough and pay attention 😂
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Post by cybrunette on Oct 12, 2023 10:21:56 GMT -6
I always think it’s fun seeing what other bands do with same/similar shows or certain arranged movements. Just this year and even last year alone I’ve seen a large number of bands use Tarpons 2021 ballad arrangement of ‘Yellow’. These programs have their twist & take on it using their own show concepts and even the pieces use in the opener & closer make the use of that ballad unique within something familiar!
I also can’t even count how many programs have used the entire ‘Beetlejuice’ show from start to finish. What I find a pleasure to read are on comment sections of different schools that have done this show in the past, you see students that are excited & ready to begin learning it! I can’t imagine how many students all around would be thrilled to play even a portion or a Hebron show lol
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Post by das88 on Oct 12, 2023 16:08:01 GMT -6
I think the idea is to offer a slightly different take on a classic piece of music or drill design. Given that this is an educational experience, some bands just want to give their kids the opportunity to perform a classic show. High school bands have taken a lot of material from DCI over the years. I also come from the era when theme based shows were taking root and a lot of bands did similar shows as the endless possibilities of how to construct a show around a theme were still being cultivated. It was always interesting to see different bands do the same or similar shows back then. Common shows back then (and in many cases still common today) were West Side Story, the Sound of Music, Phantom of the Opera, Jesus Christ Superstar, Henry V, Spartacus, Les Misérables, The Wind and the Lion, Candide, Gloria, Cats, Music of Copeland (Appalachian Spring), Fiddler on the Roof, (Oz) Somewhere Over the Rainbow, Disney, Music of Barber, Music of Stravinsky, Rocky Point Holiday, Pines of Rome, Gates of Kiev, New World Symphony, Holst the Planets, etc, etc, etc. While these shows often have had a lot of similarities, they have also had differences. "Recycled" music and drill material have always been a part of the marching arts. I like that. I like seeing bands do a similar show as another band but put a unique/different spin on it. Robin Hood, Prince of Thieves says hello. In the early 90s for a couple of years there were at least a dozen bands who used this movie as source music in Indiana. 4 dozen with Les Misérables |
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Post by philodemus on Oct 12, 2023 16:52:35 GMT -6
Would’ve been 91, if I recall correctly: The Fall of Fiddler.
Like, every band in Kentucky decided they just had to perform Fiddler on the Roof.
So. Many. Bottle. Dances.
Then, 93 was Robin Hood for days.
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Post by boahistorybuff on Oct 12, 2023 17:00:47 GMT -6
Yes in those early years of themed based shows Broadway and movie soundtracks were very popular. My senior year in 1991 we did music from the Henry V soundtrack. Chesterton IN also did this show. Both of us were in BOA Toledo Finals. Those types of things were pretty common back then.
I did forget to mention Robin Hood. I remember a lot of bands doing that. I also forget to mention the Gershwin shows that were prominent in that late 80s/early 90s era.
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Post by coleeich on Oct 13, 2023 12:27:14 GMT -6
I also find it fascinating to watch literal clone shows and just compare. Back a few years ago before Edmond Santa Fe started being really competitive in the Oklahoma scene, they almost ALWAYS had a Grand National finals tier show clone. Naturally, ESF was not at Grand National finals level, but it was so fun to see those same exact shows being performed by a different group. For example: ESF 2014 was called "Going Viral" which may be familiar as Carmel performed the same show in 2011. Another one they did was Kennesaw Mountain's 2010 show "Awakening Angels." Just a couple examples, but it really is fascinating to me. It's also a really interesting study on how a finances impact a production (ESF has a much lower budget than these other bands at the time).
ESFHS 2014:
Carmel 2011:
ESFHS 2013:
Kennesaw Mountain 2010:
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Post by OldSchoolTrumpet on Oct 13, 2023 12:59:39 GMT -6
Here's a local show that was "re-done" five years after the original. "The Lost Melody," first performed by Homestead in 2012, all original music by Kent Klee. That show (which was one of Homestead's strongest performances) finished 2nd at ISSMA State Finals, a half point back of Carmel's spider show that would win GN's a couple of weeks later, and ahead of Avon, the last time Homestead would outscore Avon.
It was re-done by FW North Side in 2017, pretty much note for note, though the drill is a bit different as North Side obviously didn't have Homestead's numbers.
The Lost Melody, Homestead 2012
The Lost Melody, FW North Side 2017
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Post by kdivine on Nov 17, 2023 20:42:46 GMT -6
Van Buren repeated-ish the Dobyns-Bennet winter guard show["The Bride"]from April that won Scholastic A. They changed out "It's All Coming Back to Me" by Celine Dion and "Lady" by Kenny Rogers for "Wicked Game" by Chris Izaak and adapted the drill and music for MB but the basic libretto was the same. Scuttlebutt was they had tried to buy the D-B set and sound package, were told no, and then proceeded to do the show anyway, with some adaptation.
The issue is not so much in repeating or closely resembling a show, because that has happened more often than people realize, but more that it's repeated in a manner that is ethically gray , and that it was so immediately after the first show appeared.
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Post by ilikeguard on Nov 17, 2023 22:53:09 GMT -6
Van Buren repeated-ish the Dobyns-Bennet winter guard show["The Bride"]from April that won Scholastic A. They changed out "It's All Coming Back to Me" by Celine Dion and "Lady" by Kenny Rogers for "Wicked Game" by Chris Izaak and adapted the drill and music for MB but the basic libretto was the same. Scuttlebutt was they had tried to buy the D-B set and sound package, were told no, and then proceeded to do the show anyway, with some adaptation. The issue is not so much in repeating or closely resembling a show, because that has happened more often than people realize, but more that it's repeated in a manner that is ethically gray , and that it was so immediately after the first show appeared. To be frank I am not at all surprised to see Van Buren and "ethically gray" in the same post |
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Post by kdivine on Nov 18, 2023 5:40:56 GMT -6
Van Buren repeated-ish the Dobyns-Bennet winter guard show["The Bride"]from April that won Scholastic A. They changed out "It's All Coming Back to Me" by Celine Dion and "Lady" by Kenny Rogers for "Wicked Game" by Chris Izaak and adapted the drill and music for MB but the basic libretto was the same. Scuttlebutt was they had tried to buy the D-B set and sound package, were told no, and then proceeded to do the show anyway, with some adaptation. The issue is not so much in repeating or closely resembling a show, because that has happened more often than people realize, but more that it's repeated in a manner that is ethically gray , and that it was so immediately after the first show appeared. To be frank I am not at all surprised to see Van Buren and "ethically gray" in the same post Well, at State, their singer's mic just completely popped on "Wicked Game"-- no signal at all, so no melody for nearly two minutes. On the one hand, it was like, "Oh, that poor girl, she must be wanting to melt off the field right now...", but the kids finished the show like professionals and it was impressive from that standpoint. OTOH.....there were so many muffled nasal snorks in my section of War Memorial Stadium that I was wondering if anyone brought a box of Kleenex we could pass around. It was just a bit schadenfreude-y there for a moment. For all that, they still finished second in Arkansas 6A and [unofficially] outpointed everyone in 7A except Bentonville, which just goes to show how nutty the ASBOA sheets can be. |
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Post by redpants on Nov 19, 2023 17:38:41 GMT -6
This thread calls to my mind a feeling I get every year at the end of GN, when I think “well there are 90 more marching band shows that will never ever be performed again.” I won’t pretend I would miss all of them (or that I saw even half of them) but I’m happy to know that some shows get re-used. It seems a waste for all the work that goes into shows for them to see the light of day for two months one fall and never again. As long as it’s done ethically I’m all for some more shows getting extra life, and perhaps even new interpretations.
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Post by LeanderMomma on Nov 19, 2023 18:56:01 GMT -6
There’s a school in California that used to perform Leander recycled shows for years. It was always interesting to watch them on YouTube and see how they interpreted the theme and music just a little bit differently.
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Post by boahistorybuff on Nov 20, 2023 5:56:43 GMT -6
There’s a school in California that used to perform Leander recycled shows for years. It was always interesting to watch them on YouTube and see how they interpreted the theme and music just a little bit differently. Probably because Leander is awesome. |
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Post by boahistorybuff on Nov 20, 2023 6:14:08 GMT -6
This thread calls to my mind a feeling I get every year at the end of GN, when I think “well there are 90 more marching band shows that will never ever be performed again.” I won’t pretend I would miss all of them (or that I saw even half of them) but I’m happy to know that some shows get re-used. It seems a waste for all the work that goes into shows for them to see the light of day for two months one fall and never again. As long as it’s done ethically I’m all for some more shows getting extra life, and perhaps even new interpretations. This is why video archives are so important. There are two of my high school bands performances from when I was in the program on YouTube. At the time we had no idea that our shows would be viewable by the masses over 30 years later. It feels good knowing that all that work is still paying off decades later. I also like video archives because it pays homage to those programs of the past that helped raise the bar. The reason why bands are so much better overall today then they were 40 to 50 years ago is because year by year the bar kept getting raised. It is how competition strengthens the activity over time. I am a firm believer in acknowledging those bands and performances of the past that helped make the activity what it is today. |
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Post by horntrumpetdad on Nov 20, 2023 8:44:42 GMT -6
There’s a school in California that used to perform Leander recycled shows for years. It was always interesting to watch them on YouTube and see how they interpreted the theme and music just a little bit differently. The composer/arranger that creates our band's original shows most years, retains the rights and then offers them for sale after our band has finished performing it for the season. He creates several shows per year for various bands, and they are all on offer after the current season. This year I saw a YouTube video of a band in Illinois performing our original show from last year, and I loved seeing it. It was so interesting to see the different design choices they made with the visual elements, and even a small handful of changes to the musical arrangement. But I loved that show so much, I was delighted to see another band get to make use of it, and breathe some new life into it. It's just a fact that original shows are incredibly expensive to custom-order and not all bands are going to have the budget for it. Our school places a high priority on marching band and we're fortunate to have students, boosters, and fans that are willing to do the extraordinary amount of fundraising it takes to produce an all-original, custom-designed show each year. So I'm more than happy to see a show recycled if it means a new band will receive a high quality product at a reduced price that fits its budget. And those shows deserve more than one run, too. |
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