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Post by trumpet300 on Oct 29, 2019 19:56:56 GMT -6
I know this thread existed on the MFA forums and I think we should start it up again over here. BOAhistorybuff, you may be able to remember the rules and requirements better than me.
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Post by Allohak on Oct 29, 2019 20:07:16 GMT -6
I know this thread existed on the MFA forums and I think we should start it up again over here. BOAhistorybuff, you may be able to remember the rules and requirements better than me. IIRC, all we did in that thread was try to come up with parameters for inclusion. Things like: -Individual shows or programs as a whole? -Include all regional winners? -Include all GN finalists? -How do we account for small-school programs who don't neccesarily win contests? -How do we account for the incredible differences between eras in the activity? Shows in the late 80s were very different from what we see today. Perhaps there's a way to split up eras with different "qualifications" for each? 1980-1995 (pre-semifinals), 1996-2007 (semifinals), 2008-present (move to LOS)? -What sort of agreement is necessary for the honor? Anybody can throw out a name and give some sort of justification, but not every group/show needs to be included. Could grow out of hand very quickly. I'd be all for discussion about compiling some sort of list! (I love lists!)
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Post by pocobill on Oct 29, 2019 21:18:36 GMT -6
Amplified versus non-amplified would give a good separation to time eras
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Post by dbalash on Oct 29, 2019 21:25:10 GMT -6
Amplified versus non-amplified would give a good separation to time eras That's going back 35+ years though. Marian used to march a guitar player with an amp. (wish I could find the screen shot I have of that)...
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Post by boahistorybuff on Oct 29, 2019 21:35:12 GMT -6
I do not remember the exact specifications; I think everyone had their own idea of what the criteria should be.
My suggestions would be per era;
1976 - 1983 (The MBA years)
1984 - 1992 (The early BOA years)
1993 - 1999
2000 - 2009
2010 - present
I am open to suggestions as to how to select the Hall of Fame bands.
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Post by boahistorybuff on Oct 29, 2019 21:37:09 GMT -6
Amplified versus non-amplified would give a good separation to time eras That's going back 35+ years though. Marian used to march a guitar player with an amp. (wish I could find the screen shot I have of that)... In 1979 Sylva-Webster also marched a guitar player with an amp.
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Post by Jake W. on Oct 29, 2019 21:37:26 GMT -6
Amplified versus non-amplified would give a good separation to time eras That's going back 35+ years though. Marian used to march a guitar player with an amp. (wish I could find the screen shot I have of that)... And PCEP & Greenwood had the earliest uses of narration I could ever find, both in 1994! Most people think of the hard electronics split in DCI as a separation between eras, but it's MUCH less clear in the BOA world, which, along with WGI, was much quicker to evolve throughout the 90s & 00s. As mentioned, those two groups used narration as an essential part of the show a full FIFTEEN YEARS before it was even allowed under DCI rules. There's really no clear line between amplified vs. non-amplified eras in any branch of our activity other than DCI.
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Post by boahistorybuff on Oct 29, 2019 21:44:50 GMT -6
Not to beat a dead horse, but vocal amplification in BOA goes back to at least 1991. PCEP used it as did Northmont.
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Post by trumpet300 on Oct 29, 2019 22:11:53 GMT -6
I think before we had discussed 1st place finishes in regionals, supers, and grand nats as well as class wins as part of the criteria. We can add to that or take away if we see fit but I also think top 10 to 15 should be the ballpark number to name.
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Post by Allohak on Oct 29, 2019 23:06:34 GMT -6
Programs overall I think would be pretty easy. In no particular order:
-JM Tate, FL - first Grand National Champion -Rocky Mount, NC - first multiple time and first repeat Grand National Champion -Marian Catholic, IL - most Grand National Champion titles and first three-peat, also holds longest finals appearance streak -Plymouth-Canton, MI and Spring, TX - innovators with iconic Grand National Champion shows -Avon, IN - three-peat and long streak of consecutive top-3 finishes -Carmel, IN - three-peat and longest active consecutive finals appearance streak -Norwin, PA - most Regional Champion titles -Hebron, TX - highest score achieved in a BOA performance (this achievement could someday be surpassed, and whatever group does it would take this spot, IMO)
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Post by boahistorybuff on Oct 29, 2019 23:22:15 GMT -6
Programs overall I think would be pretty easy. In no particular order: - JM Tate, FL - first Grand National Champion - Rocky Mount, NC - first multiple time and first repeat Grand National Champion - Marian Catholic, IL - most Grand National Champion titles and first three-peat, also holds longest finals appearance streak - Plymouth-Canton, MI and Spring, TX - innovators with iconic Grand National Champion shows - Avon, IN - three-peat and long streak of consecutive top-3 finishes - Carmel, IN - three-peat and longest active consecutive finals appearance streak - Norwin, PA - most Regional Champion titles - Hebron, TX - highest score achieved in a BOA performance (this achievement could someday be surpassed, and whatever group does it would take this spot, IMO) Yes Tate is the first fall Grand National champ but Live Oak, CA is technically the first Grand National champion. So I would have to add Live Oak. They are also the first band to win two Grand National titles. Of course as a Flushing alum I may have some anti 1980 Tate bias. I would also add Tarpon Springs, Broken Arrow, LD Bell and Flower Mound (given what Flower Mound has done at San Antonio in recent years).
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Post by Allohak on Oct 30, 2019 6:54:21 GMT -6
Programs overall I think would be pretty easy. In no particular order: - JM Tate, FL - first Grand National Champion - Rocky Mount, NC - first multiple time and first repeat Grand National Champion - Marian Catholic, IL - most Grand National Champion titles and first three-peat, also holds longest finals appearance streak - Plymouth-Canton, MI and Spring, TX - innovators with iconic Grand National Champion shows - Avon, IN - three-peat and long streak of consecutive top-3 finishes - Carmel, IN - three-peat and longest active consecutive finals appearance streak - Norwin, PA - most Regional Champion titles - Hebron, TX - highest score achieved in a BOA performance (this achievement could someday be surpassed, and whatever group does it would take this spot, IMO) Yes Tate is the first fall Grand National champ but Live Oak, CA is technically the first Grand National champion. So I would have to add Live Oak. They are also the first band to win two Grand National titles. Of course as a Flushing alum I may have some anti 1980 Tate bias. I would also add Tarpon Springs, Broken Arrow, LD Bell and Flower Mound (given what Flower Mound has done at San Antonio in recent years). I would almost classify the Whitewater GN contests (along with summer nationals) as a different category. Not to take anything away from those champions, but relative to the fall (football) season, how many groups around the country had their season in the spring? No issues including the others you listed along with my list above! Just didn't really have notable accomplishments to list, though I suppose they could be grouped with PCEP and Spring
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Post by boahistorybuff on Oct 30, 2019 21:21:44 GMT -6
I do see your point. In the 1980s, yes the summer competitive circuits were just not to the level of the fall circuits, especially the latter half of the decade. In the 1970s however, a lot of the corps style programs were mostly active in the summer, so the summer competitive circuits were just about on equal footing as the fall contests. A lot of articles on Live Oak that I read back in the day also discuss how much influence that band and their director Mike Rubino had on MBA. So while their days as a power house program were short, Live Oak is perhaps the most influential band from those early years of MBA in the 1970s.
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Post by boahistorybuff on Nov 24, 2019 10:01:17 GMT -6
So every once in a while I will post a band that I think should be a BOA Hall of Fame band and why. Some may or may not agree with my selections. These are just my opinions. My first selection; Live Oak HS (The Emerald Regime) from Morgan Hill, CA.Despite their rather brief time at the top, this band had a big impact on BOA (or MBA as it was known when they competed). First off, during the 1970s, summer competitive marching band circuits were as competitive as the fall circuits. Yes, they went into decline in the 80s and 90s. The summer circuits back in the 70s had more bands doing the corps style, whereas the fall circuits had a blend of bands doing corps style and those still doing half time style. I think that is why MBA held the first 4 Grand Nationals (1976 - 1979) in the summer. Live Oak attended the first three Grand Nationals; a long trip from California to Wisconsin. They won the Open Class title each year. In 1976, they became the very first band to win the Grand National title. In 1978 they became the first band to win two Grand National titles. Had they not received a penalty in 1977, they would have been the first band to three-peat. From what I read about Live Oak, they were one of the best bands in the country. Many of the bands that attended those first few years really looked up to Live Oak and wanted to be like them. I am not saying that BOA would not be what it is today without Live Oak. However, I am sure that it helped lend validity to the new circuit (Marching Bands of America back then) to have the winner of the national title be as strong a band as Live Oak. From what I understand, they were strong in all aspects including marching. They are probably most noted for the strength of their music, including their drumline. They were also noted to take on some challenging musical selections (in terms of that era) and apparently the old photos and poor color quality of the limited videos during this time frame do not do justice to just how bright green their uniforms were. Like so many power house programs back during the 70s and early 80s, Like Oak's days as a national power were quite brief. In 1979, they lost their director and assistant director, Mike and Cricket Rubino (back in those years the loss of a director often had huge impacts on the band). The band also lost the 9th grade class. In subsequent years, additional course requirements preventing kids from taking band and funding cuts also affected the program.
A good tribute to the legacy of the Rubinos and the Live Oak Emerald Regime can be found HERE.
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Post by iloveband on Nov 27, 2019 4:48:59 GMT -6
good tribute to the legacy of the Rubinos and the Live Oak Emerald Regime can be found HERE
Love this!
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Post by boahistorybuff on Dec 3, 2019 4:38:47 GMT -6
My 2nd Choice: Rocky Mount HS (The Marching Gryphons) from Rocky Mount, NCThis is another band whose glory years in BOA were brief but highly influential. Rocky Mount's accolades include; BOA (MBA) regional finalists somewhere between 10 and 14 times during the 1980s. 5 time regional champions, 5 time Grand National finalists (81-84,86), 3 time Grand National Class and Overall Grand National Champions (83,84,86). They are the first band to win back to back GN titles and the first band to win three GN titles. A program that emerged during the 1970s, their marching band really took off in the early 1980s, the result of two main factors. First, their director John Sykes was instrumental in building the program. Second, they had received corporate sponsorships that allowed them to hire a large instructional/design staff (many of whom were involved with top level DCI corps). This added financial boost also allowed them to be well traveled. Rocky Mount was a band that really embraced the changes that occurred in DCI during the early to mid 1980s, which may have helped ensure those changes carried into the high school marching band circuit. This included the early use of asymmetrical drill and a more artistically dressed color guard. Rocky Mount also pushed the envelope in terms of both musical and visual difficulty. Their 84 opener "Rocky Point Holiday" and 86 closer "Intrusions" are good examples of what set them apart from other bands of the era. As progressive as this band was, they were still a few years prior to themed shows really taking hold. So their repertoire of a selection of songs was pretty typical for the era. This included the concert piece in the middle of the show; an up tempo piece where the band stood still while performing a large portion of the song. Many bands chose a jazz piece for this section which is what Rocky Mount did. Their jazz performances during these sections of their shows really brought the house down. They were absolutely fantastic; some of the best jazz performed by a high school marching band during that time period. While they only attended Grand Nationals five times, had they attended in 85 and 87 they would have not only made finals but they would have been in stiff competition with Marian for the GN title. It was said that this band influenced many emerging programs during the mid 1980s. I also have a hunch that they had a big influence on Marian Catholic, maybe causing Marian to up their game in 85 and those late 80s championship years. From what I understand, after the 1987 season, their corporate sponsorships ended. The school district and parents were not in a position to make up for the loss in financial backing. Rocky Mount attended just one last BOA event after this; the 1988 Morgantown WV regional where they did make finals but fell far short of another regional title. The lack of finances essentially brought an abrupt end to Rocky Mount as a national caliber marching band. The last 25 years or so have also seen the Rocky Mount community undergo some economic hardships which I am sure has also affected the band program. Anyone who participated or watched MBA/BOA Grand Nationals during the 1980s would most certainly include Rocky Mount as one of, if not the best high school marching band of the decade.
Links to a couple MFA blog posts;
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Post by hewhowaits on Dec 3, 2019 10:45:52 GMT -6
One thing of note about the run of championships by Rocky Mount is that many consider the 1985 show that they did not take to GN the best show they produced.
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Post by boahistorybuff on Dec 12, 2019 5:01:52 GMT -6
#3 Choice (out of what will be a top 20) - Norwin HS (The Knights of Norwin) from North Huntingdon, PA
Norwin has participated in BOA every year since 1979, with the exception of 1992. They are one of the most successful bands in BOA at the regional level. As of 2019, they have been a regional finalist over 75 times, more than any other band. They have won over 35 regional class titles and as of 2019 have a total of 29 BOA regional titles, more than any other band. Norwin has actually held the distinction of being the band with the most BOA regional wins every year since 1980. In 1980, they became the first band to win two BOA regionals in the same season and in 2012 they became the first band to win three BOA regionals in the same season. They are also the only band to have won at least one BOA regional title in each of the 5 decades of BOA's existence. While their regional wins over the last 18 years or so have been from regionals that are not as competitive as other parts of the country, that is not the case for their regional wins during the 1980s when there were far fewer regionals held and the eastern regionals tended to be among the more competitive. During the 1980s, Norwin won 11 regional titles, more than double any other band in that decade.
At Grand Nationals, Norwin is a 9 time finalist (81-85, 87, 89, 90, 95), a three time Open Class Champion and the 1982 Grand National Champion. During the 1980s, Norwin was a GN finalist more times than any other band. Norwin's biggest success came under the direction of LJ Hancock who led the band from 1976 to 2001. During the first half of the 1980s, Norwin's performances were rock solid. They were also a band that started the season really strong, one of the reasons they won so many regionals. In addition to their powerful sound, they were noted for having an incredible drum line and an awesome rifle line. They were considered GN contentenders in each of their first four trips to nationals (81 - 84) and in addition to their win in 82 were runner up to the title twice. During the late 80s and throughout the 90s, Norwin had a lot of ups and downs, even failing to make GN finals on several occasions. Some notable performances did include their last three appearances in GN finals. During the 89 and 90 seasons, they did Disney themed shows (actually I believe they did a few more in the early 90s). This was the early years of the themed based shows. It was rumored that Norwin had a Disney sponsorship which gave them a big budget for props. They had large props (something that was not common in those days) and had guard and band members come out as Disney characters from time to time. While shows have become much more imaginative and sophisticated since then, during that time period, the Norwin Disney shows were quite innovative. The whole idea of these bigger budget shows with props and costuming would gain in popularity in the coming years.
The controversial departure and subsequent passing of long time director LJ Hancock in the early 2000s obviously hit the program hard. Norwin has since had a few director changes over the years. Their school district has also seen a drop in enrollment, which probably also means some drop in financial support. These things have likely posed some challenges in recent years. However, Norwin has remained a strong competitor in BOA events across the northeast and has had several good shows over the years. Their only trip to GN since 1997 was in 2011 when they finished 19th in semi finals. I hope this program continues to remain strong for years to come.
A Brief History of the Norwin Band
LJ Hancok BOA Hall of Fame
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Post by trumpet300 on Dec 12, 2019 10:23:05 GMT -6
#3 Choice (out of what will be a top 20) - Norwin HS (The Knights of Norwin) from North Huntingdon, PA
Norwin has participated in BOA every year since 1979, with the exception of 1992. They are one of the most successful bands in BOA at the regional level. As of 2019, they have been a regional finalist over 75 times, more than any other band. They have won over 35 regional class titles and as of 2019 have a total of 29 BOA regional titles, more than any other band. Norwin has actually held the distinction of being the band with the most BOA regional wins every year since 1980. In 1980, they became the first band to win two BOA regionals in the same season and in 2012 they became the first band to win three BOA regionals in the same season. They are also the only band to have won at least one BOA regional title in each of the 5 decades of BOA's existence. While their regional wins over the last 18 years or so have been from regionals that are not as competitive as other parts of the country, that is not the case for their regional wins during the 1980s when there were far fewer regionals held and the eastern regionals tended to be among the more competitive. During the 1980s, Norwin won 11 regional titles, more than double any other band in that decade.
At Grand Nationals, Norwin is a 9 time finalist (81-85, 87, 89, 90, 95), a three time Open Class Champion and the 1982 Grand National Champion. During the 1980s, Norwin was a GN finalist more times than any other band. Norwin's biggest success came under the direction of LJ Hancock who led the band from 1976 to 2001. During the first half of the 1980s, Norwin's performances were rock solid. They were also a band that started the season really strong, one of the reasons they won so many regionals. In addition to their powerful sound, they were noted for having an incredible drum line and an awesome rifle line. They were considered GN contentenders in each of their first four trips to nationals (81 - 84) and in addition to their win in 82 were runner up to the title twice. During the late 80s and throughout the 90s, Norwin had a lot of ups and downs, even failing to make GN finals on several occasions. Some notable performances did include their last three appearances in GN finals. During the 89 and 90 seasons, they did Disney themed shows (actually I believe they did a few more in the early 90s). This was the early years of the themed based shows. It was rumored that Norwin had a Disney sponsorship which gave them a big budget for props. They had large props (something that was not common in those days) and had guard and band members come out as Disney characters from time to time. While shows have become much more imaginative and sophisticated since then, during that time period, the Norwin Disney shows were quite innovative. The whole idea of these bigger budget shows with props and costuming would gain in popularity in the coming years.
The controversial departure and subsequent passing of long time director LJ Hancock in the early 2000s obviously hit the program hard. Norwin has since had a few director changes over the years. Their school district has also seen a drop in enrollment, which probably also means some drop in financial support. These things have likely posed some challenges in recent years. However, Norwin has remained a strong competitor in BOA events across the northeast and has had several good shows over the years. Their only trip to GN since 1997 was in 2011 when they finished 19th in semi finals. I hope this program continues to remain strong for years to come.
A Brief History of the Norwin Band
LJ Hancok BOA Hall of Fame
Fun fact, the music director at Disney world flew up to Norwin and guided them on the way the music should be played and the way the characters should act.
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Post by boahistorybuff on Dec 20, 2019 10:59:08 GMT -6
#4 Choice - Marian Catholic HS (Spartans), from Chicago Heights, IL
Yes, I am sure this is no surprise to anyone. As of the end of the end of the 2019 season, the following are their accolades: At the BOA regional level, Marian has been a finalist over 40 times and a regional class champion over 20 times. They have won 5 BOA regional titles. During the 1980s, Marian won five consecutive summer national titles. At Grand Nationals, there is no other band that has had more success. Marian Catholic is a 34 time Grand National finalist (1984 to 2017), more times than any other band by a long shot. Marian has won 21 Grand National Class titles (20 AA and 1 AAA), which is more than double any other band. They have also won the Grand National title 7 times (85,87,88,89,94,97,2000), more than any other band. This includes becoming the first band to win three consecutive Grand National titles.
Marian has had one head director throughout all of this success, Mr. Greg Bimm, who has directed the Marian Catholic marching band since 1977. I think if you ask those outside of the program what is the secret to Marian's success, they would say the genius that is Greg Bimm. Keep in mind that he has also been their primary music arranger and drill writer for decades. In various interviews with Mr Bimm that I have read or seen, Mr. Bimm credits the hard work of Marian's students and the support from the Marian school administration and parents. The story goes that Mr. Bimm became director of Marian in 1977 when they were a small and struggling band program. He then built the band program to become a national power house by the mid 1980s. He has managed to sustain the program at this level for decades. Some unique aspects about the Marian Catholic marching band is that their students come into the program as freshman from all different middle school programs throughout mostly the southern Chicago suburbs with varying degrees of skill. Mr. Bimm must then take those students and bring them up to the level that is Marian. Marian's marching band also heavily uses student leaders (mainly seniors) to assist in the instruction of the band, especially during sectionals. These facts make their success even more impressive.
During the 1980s, no band won more Grand National titles than Marian. They were a pioneering band in the art of making a marching band sound more like a symphonic band. The depth, the phrasing and the nuances of their music were exceptional. They also proved that a marching band does not always have to play loud to be effective. They superbly illustrated this in their 1989 show where they performed Webber's "Pie Jesu" in the mid section of the show. At that point in time, I don't think another high school marching band put forth so much emotion on the field. Another area that Marian was making strides in during the 1980s was in visual difficulty. It seemed that each season from 84 through 89, their drill became a little more difficult and complex and their guard routines became more challenging; this as their music performances got better and better.
Right from the start of the 1990s, and persisting through the rest of the decade and into the 2000s, Marian took things to a whole new level. They began playing more complex music and musical arrangements. I would say they probably played more notes than any other band. They were also among one of the bands who were testing the ability of students to tackle things like frequent tempo changes and mixed metering. Many of their music performances would fluctuate from fast and furious, to soft and subtle, then back to fast and furious. The technical ability that their band members exhibited was amazing. Often times they would take on music selections that no other band would dare try to accomplish on the field. It was almost as if they would take insanely difficult music, turn it inside out and then play it. Their shows also packed a ton of visual difficulty into them as well. Marian was constantly in motion, often times doing rapid directional shifts, blind drill passes and other complex drill moves. Their visual designs also packed a ton of symbolism into the drill. Due to the difficulty of their shows, it would usually take the band until right up to Grand Nationals to perfect it. This is why since 1990 they have only won one regional title, despite picking up three more GN titles and finishing in the top five in finals numerous times. Even in the 2010s, as shows have taken on a significantly larger production value, Marian has managed to keep up with the times. The level of creativity in their 2011 The Passion Tree show and 2015's String Theory are two prime examples.
It still has taken some getting used to the fact that Marian has failed to make GN finals the last two seasons. Keep in mind they still have had top 20 finished in Semi Finals. One of the reasons for this is of course the fact that Grand Nationals and BOA in general has become significantly more competitive. I would actually say that their 2019 GN semi finals performance would have made finals 10 years ago. Another challenge that Marian has faced is declining enrollment for over a decade. I think that in the 2019 season their high school enrollment dropped to under 1000 students, making them a significantly smaller school in comparison to the sizes of the schools that the bands finishing in the top half of GN semi finals come from. I suspect there may also be some decline in enrollment and/or funding cuts to the elementary and middle school programs that feed into Marian. These factors and the inevitable future retirement of Greg Bimm will be challenges that Marian will have to face this next decade. I have heard Mr Bimm say in interviews that the Marian Catholic marching band would not have been as strong a band without BOA. I would in turn say that BOA would not be what it is today without Marian Catholic.
Chicago Tribune video on Marian from 2009
2005 - Greg Bimm BOA Hall of Fame
2012 GN clip
2013 GN clip
2014 Gn clip
2015 GN clip
2016 GN clip
2017 GN clip
A few select Greg Bimm interviews
2009
2012
2013 - GN finals
2015 - GN finals warm up
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Post by dbalash on Dec 20, 2019 12:50:37 GMT -6
#4 Choice - Marian Catholic HS (Spartans), from Chicago Heights, IL
Yes, I am sure this is no surprise to anyone. As of the end of the end of the 2019 season, the following are their accolades: At the BOA regional level, Marian has been a finalist over 40 times and a regional class champion over 20 times. They have won 5 BOA regional titles. During the 1980s, Marian won five consecutive summer national titles. At Grand Nationals, there is no other band that has had more success. Marian Catholic is a 34 time Grand National finalist (1984 to 2017), more times than any other band by a long shot. Marian has won 21 Grand National Class titles (20 AA and 1 AAA), which is more than double any other band. They have also won the Grand National title 7 times (85,87,88,89,94,97,2000), more than any other band. This includes becoming the first band to win three consecutive Grand National titles.
Marian has had one head director throughout all of this success, Mr. Greg Bimm, who has directed the Marian Catholic marching band since 1977. I think if you ask those outside of the program what is the secret to Marian's success, they would say the genius that is Greg Bimm. Keep in mind that he has also been their primary music arranger and drill writer for decades. In various interviews with Mr Bimm that I have read or seen, Mr. Bimm credits the hard work of Marian's students and the support from the Marian school administration and parents. The story goes that Mr. Bimm became director of Marian in 1977 when they were a small and struggling band program. He then built the band program to become a national power house by the mid 1980s. He has managed to sustain the program at this level for decades. Some unique aspects about the Marian Catholic marching band is that their students come into the program as freshman from all different middle school programs throughout mostly the southern Chicago suburbs with varying degrees of skill. Mr. Bimm must then take those students and bring them up to the level that is Marian. Marian's marching band also heavily uses student leaders (mainly seniors) to assist in the instruction of the band, especially during sectionals. These facts make their success even more impressive.
During the 1980s, no band won more Grand National titles than Marian. They were a pioneering band in the art of making a marching band sound more like a symphonic band. The depth, the phrasing and the nuances of their music were exceptional. They also proved that a marching band does not always have to play loud to be effective. They superbly illustrated this in their 1989 show where they performed Webber's "Pie Jesu" in the mid section of the show. At that point in time, I don't think another high school marching band put forth so much emotion on the field. Another area that Marian was making strides in during the 1980s was in visual difficulty. It seemed that each season from 84 through 89, their drill became a little more difficult and complex and their guard routines became more challenging; this as their music performances got better and better.
Right from the start of the 1990s, and persisting through the rest of the decade and into the 2000s, Marian took things to a whole new level. They began playing more complex music and musical arrangements. I would say they probably played more notes than any other band. They were also among one of the bands who were testing the ability of students to tackle things like frequent tempo changes and mixed metering. Many of their music performances would fluctuate from fast and furious, to soft and subtle, then back to fast and furious. The technical ability that their band members exhibited was amazing. Often times they would take on music selections that no other band would dare try to accomplish on the field. It was almost as if they would take insanely difficult music, turn it inside out and then play it. Their shows also packed a ton of visual difficulty into them as well. Marian was constantly in motion, often times doing rapid directional shifts, blind drill passes and other complex drill moves. Their visual designs also packed a ton of symbolism into the drill. Due to the difficulty of their shows, it would usually take the band until right up to Grand Nationals to perfect it. This is why since 1990 they have only won one regional title, despite picking up three more GN titles and finishing in the top five in finals numerous times. Even in the 2010s, as shows have taken on a significantly larger production value, Marian has managed to keep up with the times. The level of creativity in their 2011 The Passion Tree show and 2015's String Theory are two prime examples.
It still has taken some getting used to the fact that Marian has failed to make GN finals the last two seasons. Keep in mind they still have had top 20 finished in Semi Finals. One of the reasons for this is of course the fact that Grand Nationals and BOA in general has become significantly more competitive. I would actually say that their 2019 GN semi finals performance would have made finals 10 years ago. Another challenge that Marian has faced is declining enrollment for over a decade. I think that in the 2019 season their high school enrollment dropped to under 1000 students, making them a significantly smaller school in comparison to the sizes of the schools that the bands finishing in the top half of GN semi finals come from. I suspect there may also be some decline in enrollment and/or funding cuts to the elementary and middle school programs that feed into Marian. These factors and the inevitable future retirement of Greg Bimm will be challenges that Marian will have to face this next decade. I have heard Mr Bimm say in interviews that the Marian Catholic marching band would not have been as strong a band without BOA. I would in turn say that BOA would not be what it is today without Marian Catholic.
Chicago Tribune video on Marian from 2009
2005 - Greg Bimm BOA Hall of Fame
2012 GN clip
2013 GN clip
2014 Gn clip
2015 GN clip
2016 GN clip
2017 GN clip
A few select Greg Bimm interviews
2009
2012
2013 - GN finals
2015 - GN finals warm up
Adding on, the Marching to Glory series the Tribune did on the band in 2009 is fantastic. I can't find part 2. Part 1Part 3School and Band Orchestra magazine article from October 1999. www.jerichoshowdesign.com/directorsonly/Greg_Bimm_Article.pdf
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bandisjoy
Senior Member
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Posts: 67
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Post by bandisjoy on Dec 20, 2019 13:51:44 GMT -6
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Post by bearscott85 on Dec 22, 2019 15:58:01 GMT -6
What about Chesterton Trojan Gaurd?
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Post by boahistorybuff on Dec 23, 2019 6:27:07 GMT -6
What about Chesterton Trojan Gaurd? I opted to stop at 20 and I chose a couple bands that did not quite win a GN title. So not all GN champs are included. Chesterton and Tate will be in my honorary mention list. If I were to have expanded the list to a 25 or 30, then they would have been in there. My selection process includes bands that have had a longer period of success at BOA or like in the case of Rocky Mount and Live Oak, proved to be highly influential during their brief time at the top. Yes Chesterton was the first Indiana band to win a GN title and BOA regional, so I did consider them heavily. There will be a few Indiana bands on the list.
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Post by boahistorybuff on Jan 2, 2020 15:44:13 GMT -6
#5 Choice - Westfield HS (The Big Red Band) from Houston, TX
During the 1981 to 1982 school year, Spring South (which I believe was just for 9th graders) was converted into a full 4 year high school and renamed Westfield HS. In 1982, Philip Geiger was hired as marching band director. Within just a few short years, Mr. Geiger took this band to their first BOA Grand National where they were runner up to Marian Catholic. Mr. Geiger directed the marching band from 1982 into the middle of the 2000s. The band's biggest success came during his tenure. Westfield has been a BOA regional finalist around 30 times and have won 9 regional titles, including the very first BOA San Antonio Super Regional in 2003. Between 1984 and 1999, Westfield attended one Texas regional per season and placed either first or second every year. Westfield only attended four Grand Nationals. Had they attended more frequently between the mid 80s and mid 2000s they would have racked up many more GN finals appearances than just four. Their appearances in 1985, 1990 and 1995 garnered them second place finishes each time and two BOA Class titles. They are the first Texas band to be a GN finalist. During their fourth and final GN appearance in 2003, they picked up another class title and were crowned Grand National Champion.
During the 1980s, Texas still had many strong marching bands (of course nothing like today). The strong music education programs in the state and high attendance at high school football games (incentive for the marching band to play well) contributed to this. During the course of the 70s and 80s, as more bands began to take on the corps style programs, Texas bands for the most part seemed to fall a little behind what top level BOA bands were doing, especially in the visual aspect. Then came Westfield. They played more difficult and sophisticated music. They also brought in well renown drill designers, like Steve Brubaker. So not only were they playing more challenging music, they were marching to far more complex and difficult drill. During the latter half of the 1980s, Westfield was said to have inspired many band programs in Texas (and future band directors and designers in the state). For a few of the years in the late 80s, there was simply no other Texas band that was at the level of Westfield. They proved that you could still get a high quality ensemble sound while at the same time delivering a superb visual performance. During the 1990s, other power house Texas programs emerged; neighboring Spring was among the earliest to rise to the level of Westfield. During the entire 1990s, Westfield still churned out solid shows year after year and continued to inspire future Texas band programs. Certainly the quality of their sound and overall music performance is what they are most known for. In addition to brass and woodwinds, they also had an amazing percussion section; all qualities that have since become a signature of top level Texas bands in BOA. Westfield also showcased some instrumental features that were not too common at the time they did them, but would then become common; like the french horn solos in 1990 and the bassoon ensemble in 2003.
While the 2000s saw Westfield slip in placement at the Texas BOA regionals, they had one amazing season in 2003 where they finally picked up the Grand National title, which had eluded them in their three prior trips to Grand Nationals. The retirement of Mr Geiger in the mid 2000s and a gradual decline in Spring ISD music programs had huge impacts on Westfield. As a result, their BOA participation has dwindled this decade. Taking into consideration all of the Texas programs that were inspired by what Westfield did in the 1980s and 1990s and seeing what Texas bands are now accomplishing in BOA, I count Westfield as one of the most influential bands in BOA history.
Westfield 1990 Season Documentary - This is a fairly long (2 hour) documentary that goes through the entire 1990 season. It includes segments from the 1990 BOA Southwest Regional, The 1990 Grand National Indoor Percussion Festival and the 1990 Grand National performances.
Philip Geiger - 2020 BOA Hall of Fame Inductee - Scroll to the bottom.
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Post by madisonbandman1 on Jan 3, 2020 4:37:37 GMT -6
Wow am I loving this stuff.
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Post by boahistorybuff on Jan 13, 2020 9:47:39 GMT -6
#6 Choice - The Centerville Jazz Band from Centerville, OH
Centerville was a finalist at a few (79 and 82) regionals during the early MBA years. Since 1984, they have participated in both BOA regionals and Grand Nationals every single year. In fact, Centerville and Marian Catholic are the only two bands that have attended Grand Nationals every year since 1984. As of 2019, Centerville has been a BOA regional finalist at least 70 times. In fact, they may actually be second to Norwin in terms of total number of regional finals appearances as they have typically attended multiple BOA regionals per season. They have won 20 BOA regional titles. Between 2002 and 2005, they won 8 consecutive BOA regionals. At Grand Nationals, they have been a semi finalist every year of the semi finals era except one. They are a 19 time Grand National finalist (84,86-89, 92-2000, 03-05, 08,09) and are the 1992 Grand National Champions.
The Centerville HS marching band has a legacy that goes back to the early 20th century, when parades and small drill teams were the big thing for high school marching bands. Centerville was transformed into a national calibur competitive marching band when Wayne Markworth became director in the 1970s. He directed the band through the 2004 season when he retired. It was under Mr. Markworth that Centerville developed into one of the biggest perennial favorites in BOA. During the 70s and early 80s, jazz was often played during the up tempo part of marching band shows when the band stood still (or mostly still), known as the concert piece. In 1984, Centerville took this one step further and debuted an all jazz show and renamed themselves the Centerville Jazz Band (which they still call themselves today). Jazz would remain their main repertoire. Centerville played all kinds of jazz over the years, including big band era, funk, blues; they even infused jazz with some classical and Latin music. I imagine doing an all jazz show was not easy, but Centerville really played some great jazz. Centerville always seemed to be more about pleasing the audience rather than pleasing the judges, and the audience responded. During the 80s and 90s, when military style was still heavily present, Centerville took on a much more laid back attitude with their performance; they had to play it cool. That's not to say that they were sloppy. In fact several of their shows, especially during the 90s and 2000s, had superb visual quality and featured a world class guard. Dr Tim Lautzenheiser once referred to Centerville as the desert in Grand National finals; a seemingly perfect way to describe them. They were one of the early bands to use electronics and synthesizers in the pit. They also did a lot for saxophones in marching band. They typically had a large saxophone section in relation to their band size and really used them well, not to mention some of the amazing sax solos and ensembles that appeared throughout Centerville's history. They were also one of the earliest bands to have their soloists or ensemble groups wear sunglasses; again had to add that cool factor. Even today, when I hear a great jazz soloist in BOA, I think back to Centerville.
One of the success stories with Centerville has been the fact that the retirement of Mr. Markworth did not lead to the demise of the band program. Since his retirement, Centerville went on to make three more appearances in Grand National finals and won several more BOA regional titles. They have also been near consistent GN semi finalists and regional finalists. Even though they have not made GN finals since 2009, they continue to put forth strong and entertaining shows, although there have been a few years where they have strayed a bit farther from their jazz roots. Wayne's son Andrew took over the band program the first few years after Wayne's retirement. Since 2007, they have been under the direction of Brandon Barrometti. Their 20th place finish in the hyper competitive 2019 Grand National semi finals suggests they still have many years of success ahead of them.
A brief history of the band from their website
2007 - Wayne Markworth BOA Hall of Fame
Wayne Markworth BOA Hall of Fame - 2007 Video
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Post by verysaxy on Jan 13, 2020 21:23:25 GMT -6
If this were MY hall of fame, here’s who I would put in:
#1: Marian Catholic, IL - Call me a Marian Catholic disliker (hate is a strong word), but no one can deny their presence in BOA. Their past is like no other, holding/have held countless records, and is still on of the best bands in the country. Even with their missing of 2018/19 GN finals, that doesn’t make them any worse, I just feel like the field itself is getting more competitive. Marian also has a special quality they’ve held for years. They can get stomped week 1 of BOA or week 9, and they won’t let it get to them. They’ll clean what matters and come back in November and perform it better than ever and win a trophy (every other year, of course).
#2: JM Tate, FL - First fall GN champion.
#3: Live Oak, CA - Regardless on whether you agree with the Whitewater championships or not, they still deserve some recognition for being the official first BOA GN champion.
#4: Carmel, IN - They are the Marian Catholic of our time. The Carmel High School Marching Greyhounds is one of the most prestige music programs in the world. With 22 regional championships under their belt, from Oxford to San Antonio to Bakersfield, Carmel has an influence on everyone, everywhere. Not to mention they are the most recent band to pull off a “3-peat” and have been a big dog on the national stage for over 20 years now.
#5: Hebron, TX - Hebron is fairly new to BOA, compared to some others on this list. Simply to put it, Hebron is on this list because they currently hold the record for highest score EVER recorded in BOA history. This record could always be broken, but Hebron is also recognizable for many other things. The two times Hebron has gone to nationals, the have won Outstanding Music and placed 3rd, a huge accomplishment.
#6: Avon, IN - No one gets second like Avon does, that’s for sure. Avon has been on the national stage of BOA pushing 20 years now, and have 3 GN championships under their belt. They have won the Indianapolis Super Regional more than any other band, and pulled off a “3-peat” from 2008-2010. My main reason for putting them on my list is because they have remained in the top 3 at nats without winning for a decade now. They come back every year, fighting harder. Personally, I am a huge fan of Avon’s and was TeamIndy this year, but it seems like for Avon there’s always next year. Avon is a great band no matter where they place, and will forever hold a legacy within BOA.
#7: Plymouth-Canton Ed. Park, MI - PCEP is one of the most widely known bands in America. Although they may be on a recent decline, PCEP certainly has a legacy behind them. They have 3 national championships under their belt and plenty of regionals. They still hold a large presence in Michigan/Ohio, regularly medaling at northern regionals.
#8: Ronald Reagan, TX - Ronald Reagan has been successful on the national stage since the early 2000’s. Most recently winning the San Antonio Super, Reagan arguably would’ve won GN this year. They consistently placed second at nationals in the early 2000’s and placed 7th in 2016. The precedes their victory season with a 2nd place finish to Flower Mound, TX in 2018. Ronald Reagan will forever go down as one of the best bands in America!
#9: Lawrence Central, IN - Before merging with Lawrence North to create Lawrence Township, Lawrence Central was one of the most, if not the most, prestige bands in the land. Although they did not win too many regional championship titles, they were a powerhouse, constantly placing second or third mostly after, but sometimes before Carmel and Avon at local regionals. With 2 GN championships to their name, Lawrence Central certainly has a lot to be proud of.
#10: Broken Arrow, OK - Broken Arrow is also fairly new to being a powerhouse in BOA. Broken Arrow hasn’t placed under 5th at Grand Nationals in a long while, and is right on Carmel’s tail for that title. They have titles from St. Louis to Atlanta to Orlando. Broken Arrow is known for having fun shows, and even one drove go carts on the field! I always enjoy guessing what their shows are about. Broken Arrow has 2 GN championships under their belt and is one of the best bands and wi be for years to come.
Honorable mentions: Tarpon Springs, FL Ayala, CA LD Bell, TX Westfield, TX William Mason, OH Flower Mound, TX Marcus, TX Lassiter, GA Rocky Mount, NC
BoaHistoryBuff, I like what you’re doing. Continue! I look forward to your posts, as it is always good entertainment.
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Post by dallasman on Jan 15, 2020 11:33:18 GMT -6
If this were MY hall of fame, here’s who I would put in: #1: Marian Catholic, IL - Call me a Marian Catholic disliker (hate is a strong word), but no one can deny their presence in BOA. Their past is like no other, holding/have held countless records, and is still on of the best bands in the country. Even with their missing of 2018/19 GN finals, that doesn’t make them any worse, I just feel like the field itself is getting more competitive. Marian also has a special quality they’ve held for years. They can get stomped week 1 of BOA or week 9, and they won’t let it get to them. They’ll clean what matters and come back in November and perform it better than ever and win a trophy (every other year, of course). #2: JM Tate, FL - First fall GN champion. #3: Live Oak, CA - Regardless on whether you agree with the Whitewater championships or not, they still deserve some recognition for being the official first BOA GN champion. #4: Carmel, IN - They are the Marian Catholic of our time. The Carmel High School Marching Greyhounds is one of the most prestige music programs in the world. With 22 regional championships under their belt, from Oxford to San Antonio to Bakersfield, Carmel has an influence on everyone, everywhere. Not to mention they are the most recent band to pull off a “3-peat” and have been a big dog on the national stage for over 20 years now. #5: Hebron, TX - Hebron is fairly new to BOA, compared to some others on this list. Simply to put it, Hebron is on this list because they currently hold the record for highest score EVER recorded in BOA history. This record could always be broken, but Hebron is also recognizable for many other things. The two times Hebron has gone to nationals, the have won Outstanding Music and placed 3rd, a huge accomplishment. #6: Avon, IN - No one gets second like Avon does, that’s for sure. Avon has been on the national stage of BOA pushing 20 years now, and have 3 GN championships under their belt. They have won the Indianapolis Super Regional more than any other band, and pulled off a “3-peat” from 2008-2010. My main reason for putting them on my list is because they have remained in the top 3 at nats without winning for a decade now. They come back every year, fighting harder. Personally, I am a huge fan of Avon’s and was TeamIndy this year, but it seems like for Avon there’s always next year. Avon is a great band no matter where they place, and will forever hold a legacy within BOA. #7: Plymouth-Canton Ed. Park, MI - PCEP is one of the most widely known bands in America. Although they may be on a recent decline, PCEP certainly has a legacy behind them. They have 3 national championships under their belt and plenty of regionals. They still hold a large presence in Michigan/Ohio, regularly medaling at northern regionals. #8: Ronald Reagan, TX - Ronald Reagan has been successful on the national stage since the early 2000’s. Most recently winning the San Antonio Super, Reagan arguably would’ve won GN this year. They consistently placed second at nationals in the early 2000’s and placed 7th in 2016. The precedes their victory season with a 2nd place finish to Flower Mound, TX in 2018. Ronald Reagan will forever go down as one of the best bands in America! #9: Lawrence Central, IN - Before merging with Lawrence North to create Lawrence Township, Lawrence Central was one of the most, if not the most, prestige bands in the land. Although they did not win too many regional championship titles, they were a powerhouse, constantly placing second or third mostly after, but sometimes before Carmel and Avon at local regionals. With 2 GN championships to their name, Lawrence Central certainly has a lot to be proud of. #10: Broken Arrow, OK - Broken Arrow is also fairly new to being a powerhouse in BOA. Broken Arrow hasn’t placed under 5th at Grand Nationals in a long while, and is right on Carmel’s tail for that title. They have titles from St. Louis to Atlanta to Orlando. Broken Arrow is known for having fun shows, and even one drove go carts on the field! I always enjoy guessing what their shows are about. Broken Arrow has 2 GN championships under their belt and is one of the best bands and wi be for years to come. Honorable mentions: Tarpon Springs, FL Ayala, CA LD Bell, TX Westfield, TX William Mason, OH Flower Mound, TX Marcus, TX Lassiter, GA Rocky Mount, NC BoaHistoryBuff, I like what you’re doing. Continue! I look forward to your posts, as it is always good entertainment. Tarpon > Hebron by a long shot.
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Post by LeanderMomma on Jan 15, 2020 17:45:57 GMT -6
I don’t agree that Tarpon is better than Hebron but I definitely agree that Tarpon should be on the list before ANY Texas band. Except maybe Reagan. Reagan earned their spot a long time ago.
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