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Post by abtwitch on Nov 13, 2023 16:33:42 GMT -6
I feel like the NO AUDITION part of this hasn't been emphasized enough. So again this isn't like taking the best high school aged musicians in the entirety of Pinellas County and throwing them into one school, it's whoever applies and gets accepted, probably on academic performance. Middle school band education probably is pretty low quality in the district at most of the schools. I don't think population of the county has that huge of an impact impact on this, at least not any more than it does for any highly populated area. What Tarpon does benefit from in this system is that basically every single person who is there WANTS to be there. That level of buy-in is something that basically any competitive marching program in the country regardless of size would kill for.
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Post by OldSchoolTrumpet on Nov 13, 2023 16:38:25 GMT -6
I just found this thread. It's so nuts that I'm not even sure who to be mad at.
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Post by floridaman on Nov 13, 2023 16:56:17 GMT -6
Guys if numbers actually mattered then Hialeah Senior High's Visual and Music Performing Arts magnet program would be grand champions every year. They got 2.6 million down there. They might have to contend with Allen High School in Texas with their 800 band students, but Hialeah's no doubt the better program because they can pick and choose from all 139 schools they have (using the site I saw on the 1st page).
#miamiontop
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Post by thewho on Nov 13, 2023 17:12:19 GMT -6
I feel like the NO AUDITION part of this hasn't been emphasized enough. So again this isn't like taking the best high school aged musicians in the entirety of Pinellas County and throwing them into one school, it's whoever applies and gets accepted, probably on academic performance. Middle school band education probably is pretty low quality in the district at most of the schools. I don't think population of the county has that huge of an impact impact on this, at least not any more than it does for any highly populated area. What Tarpon does benefit from in this system is that basically every single person who is there WANTS to be there. That level of buy-in is something that basically any competitive marching program in the country regardless of size would kill for. To simply put in dumb band terms, this is a Marian Catholic situation where there may be a few students who can't play their instruments signing up for the program. Sure, it helps these tend to be the more driven ones vs. MC taking in everyone who signs up, but this is what's happening. This is the most Tarpon Springs can recruit into their program! Even my inner-city high school in Fort Wayne, still with a competitive band, has a quasi-feeder middle school. Did you all know that Tarpon Springs used to march without a drumline and still made finals? Did you all also know that real OG's remember Tarpon Springs being the size of Dartmouth AND still made Finals? ? ? This didn't come out of nowhere for them. Honestly, the entire Tarpon Springs success can be attributed the Fords' passion for making this entire thing work. They could leave Tarpon Springs for some other venture, but they've stuck with this throughout the years and the success Tarpon Springs has seen in BOA is evidence of that.
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Post by floridaman on Nov 13, 2023 17:21:22 GMT -6
I feel like the NO AUDITION part of this hasn't been emphasized enough. So again this isn't like taking the best high school aged musicians in the entirety of Pinellas County and throwing them into one school, it's whoever applies and gets accepted, probably on academic performance. Middle school band education probably is pretty low quality in the district at most of the schools. I don't think population of the county has that huge of an impact impact on this, at least not any more than it does for any highly populated area. What Tarpon does benefit from in this system is that basically every single person who is there WANTS to be there. That level of buy-in is something that basically any competitive marching program in the country regardless of size would kill for. To simply put in dumb band terms, this is a Marian Catholic situation where there may be a few students who can't play their instruments signing up for the program. Sure, it helps these tend to be the more driven ones vs. MC taking in everyone who signs up, but this is what's happening. This is the most Tarpon Springs can recruit into their program! Even my inner-city high school in Fort Wayne, still with a competitive band, has a quasi-feeder middle school. Did you all know that Tarpon Springs used to march without a drumline and still made finals? Did you all also know that real OG's remember Tarpon Springs being the size of Dartmouth AND still made Finals? ? ? This didn't come out of nowhere for them. Honestly, the entire Tarpon Springs success can be attributed the Fords' passion for making this entire thing work. They could leave Tarpon Springs for some other venture, but they've stuck with this throughout the years and the success Tarpon Springs has seen in BOA is evidence of that. To add on. Someone can correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure Tarpon's success began AFTER the director at Seminole HS (the Seminole that was in national finals in 93 and 94) changed programs to direct at Tarpon.
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Post by ilikeguard on Nov 13, 2023 18:10:39 GMT -6
If I am called an asshole for challenging misinformation and for defending the integrity and accomplishments of high schoolers then I am clearly doing something right. The intentional misrepresentation of facts is not “bringing up points that pertained to what was being discussed”. It was a weak tactic in order to justify bitterness towards children. How is saying that Tarpon springs has significantly more students to pull from intentionally misrepresenting facts? Is 1 million less than 25K? Justifying bitterness towards children? Talk about jumping to conclusions. I don’t think he even said anything critical of TS. Lmao all he said was that they do have a lot more people in the pool of students eligible to attend. That is factual. Are we done now? There isn’t anything to debate even. You guys just started ripping on somebody for contributing to the discussion in a way that wasn’t attacking or disrespectful towards anyone. I thought it was harsh. This is not how you talk to people. I’m honestly appalled at how my criticism of a post was interpreted as a personal attack which was immediately followed up by attacking me and continuously disrespecting me, including in this post. Nowhere did I say the original poster was stupid – I said the post was, which is my opinion that I am entitled to. If someone cannot handle receiving criticism so much that they immediately resort to profanity and disrespect, that person needs to do some serious reflecting on A) their intentions in the situation and B) their response to opinions other than their own. I am embarrassed to have been involved with this exchange at all. We are setting an example. Students read what we say.
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Post by ilikeguard on Nov 13, 2023 18:13:40 GMT -6
One last note – nowhere on the TSHS webpage do the words “arts school” appear. TSLCA is not a school. These are not difficult facts to confirm that can easily prevent making comments in the first place that are misrepresentative. Let’s all practice verifying claims before we use them in our arguments!
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Post by bandirectorman on Nov 13, 2023 18:19:08 GMT -6
Guys if numbers actually mattered then Hialeah Senior High's Visual and Music Performing Arts magnet program would be grand champions every year. They got 2.6 million down there. They might have to contend with Allen High School in Texas with their 800 band students, but Hialeah's no doubt the better program because they can pick and choose from all 139 schools they have (using the site I saw on the 1st page). #miamiontop edit: FEW 'skilled in the arts' are attending Hialeah for high school....... Sorry, not happening. Not a good area. The money that flows into SFL does not flow there. Can't compare this. Tarpon isn't in a good area, TBH. I've been over there and it's kind of a war zone..
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Post by das88 on Nov 13, 2023 18:45:09 GMT -6
This topic comes up every year and is quite tiresome. We are focused on one school in the entire country (because they are very successful) who happens to have a performing arts program within their high school. Is the point of bringing this up is that they should be punished or banned from competition? Or it's just "not fair" and I want to complain? It's also not fair small private schools in city/metro areas across this county load up with division one players (football/basketball, etc) and beat the crap out of rural schools that have the students they have. Life is not fair.
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Post by thewho on Nov 13, 2023 19:13:04 GMT -6
This is such a dumb argument.
The person who instigated all this dumb crap was a known troll. He has stirred up so much in the Finals thread already.
Did anyone at any point read any of the comments throughout the thread? THIS IS LITERALLY ALL TSOPE CAN RECRUIT YEAR AFTER YEAR. THE AMOUNT OF STUDENTS ATTENDING TARPON SPRINGS RIGHT NOW PUTS THEM IN 2A. You can get angry about Tarpon Springs winning everything, but keep in mind Tarpon Springs has no reliable middle school feeders (you try coordinating across 18 middle schools, get those underpaid directors to teach the same exact way as you, and send those kids to your band without ticking anyone off) unlike most programs. Tarpon Springs is starting from a tougher spot than most.
This has been hashed across so. many. years. Sack it up, take those crocodile tears, drop em into a bucket, dump into the swamp, and go touch some grass.
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