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Post by dbalash on Jun 29, 2020 8:55:06 GMT -6
Who has more pull in this whole thing? If UIL says, "We're flipflopping," does BOA follow suit? I mean, from a revenue perspective, it would make sense for them to do so. I can't imagine any band moving forward with fielding a band in the fall if football is moved to spring in Texas. What a cluster! I would imagine if UIL flipped BOA would flip I don't think schools with students taking inordinate amounts of AP classes would react well to this.
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Post by marimba11 on Jun 29, 2020 8:58:38 GMT -6
I would imagine if UIL flipped BOA would flip I don't think schools with students taking inordinate amounts of AP classes would react well to this. There are fall AP classes, just not fall exams is what I remember.
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Post by ohioguy2 on Jun 29, 2020 9:18:54 GMT -6
Concert season isn't year-round in Texas and the state by far has the most Midwest invitations for high school bands. It also has by far the most large high school band programs. Using UIL numbers Texas had 87 high schools with enrollments of at least 3,000, 15 with 4000 or more and 4 with 5,000 or more. By comparison, Indiana (the state I have the best numbers on from ISSMA) had 10 with more than 3,000, 1 with more than 4,000 and 1 with more than 5,000. Heck, there are 315 Texas high schools with enrollments 2,000+ while Indiana has 355 total high schools. 30 over 2,000 and 152 with less than 500 students. If you combine the top 2 schools in class B at the 2019 ISSMA state finals it would only be a school of 2,641 students. Throw in 3rd pace and you are just over 3,700 students. And those are 3 competitive programs across WGI, BOA and ISSMA (marching, jazz, solo and ensemble, and concert) I am not saying that one approach is better than the other (obviously Texas puts out some really kick ass bands both marching and concert. I was simply pointing out that there is no concert "season" for most schools in my area (Indiana). To add to this involving another state, Ohio has a total of 11 schools in the entire state that would classify as AAAA by BOA standards (12 if you count Forest Hills, which is 2 schools combined together, and they each have separate concert programs). Not all of these schools even compete in BOA. Texas had 52 bands compete in the AAAA classification at the San Antonio regional alone. I don't think you can really make the correlation you're making here.
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Post by paddy on Jun 29, 2020 9:21:47 GMT -6
It also has by far the most large high school band programs. Using UIL numbers Texas had 87 high schools with enrollments of at least 3,000, 15 with 4000 or more and 4 with 5,000 or more. By comparison, Indiana (the state I have the best numbers on from ISSMA) had 10 with more than 3,000, 1 with more than 4,000 and 1 with more than 5,000. Heck, there are 315 Texas high schools with enrollments 2,000+ while Indiana has 355 total high schools. 30 over 2,000 and 152 with less than 500 students. If you combine the top 2 schools in class B at the 2019 ISSMA state finals it would only be a school of 2,641 students. Throw in 3rd pace and you are just over 3,700 students. And those are 3 competitive programs across WGI, BOA and ISSMA (marching, jazz, solo and ensemble, and concert) I am not saying that one approach is better than the other (obviously Texas puts out some really kick ass bands both marching and concert. I was simply pointing out that there is no concert "season" for most schools in my area (Indiana). To add to this involving another state, Ohio has a total of 11 schools in the entire state that would classify as AAAA by BOA standards (12 if you count Forest Hills, which is 2 schools combined together, and they each have separate concert programs). Not all of these schools even compete in BOA. Texas had 52 bands compete in the AAAA classification at the San Antonio regional alone. I don't think you can really make the correlation you're making here. Me or principalagent?
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Post by ohioguy2 on Jun 29, 2020 9:24:25 GMT -6
To add to this involving another state, Ohio has a total of 11 schools in the entire state that would classify as AAAA by BOA standards (12 if you count Forest Hills, which is 2 schools combined together, and they each have separate concert programs). Not all of these schools even compete in BOA. Texas had 52 bands compete in the AAAA classification at the San Antonio regional alone. I don't think you can really make the correlation you're making here. Me or principalagent? Principalagent, I left yours in there to add to your point. I completely agree with you. I would argue that being a part of a huge, well-funded school would be a much larger predictor of things like Midwest attendance rather than year-round or not year-round concert band.
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Post by paddy on Jun 29, 2020 9:36:06 GMT -6
Principalagent, I left yours in there to add to your point. I completely agree with you. I would argue that being a part of a huge, well-funded school would be a much larger predictor of things like Midwest attendance rather than year-round or not year-round concert band. That's what I thought, but wasn't sure. Yes, I agree with you. If you assume that on average a school can get 10% of the student population to participate in the band program, a 3000 kid school has a huge leg up on a 1500 kid school.
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Post by marimba11 on Jun 29, 2020 9:43:09 GMT -6
10% can even be high for many
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Post by paddy on Jun 29, 2020 10:02:44 GMT -6
10% can even be high for many Of course, it was simply a baseline example.
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Post by marimba11 on Jun 29, 2020 10:13:28 GMT -6
10% can even be high for many Of course, it was simply a baseline example. Yes. I wonder the pandemic will have an effect on enrollment if students can stay home for school instead. Many factors here which can really hurt bands. I hope it isn't too severe.
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Post by Allohak on Jun 29, 2020 10:42:38 GMT -6
To add to this involving another state, Ohio has a total of 11 schools in the entire state that would classify as AAAA by BOA standards (12 if you count Forest Hills, which is 2 schools combined together, and they each have separate concert programs). Not all of these schools even compete in BOA. Texas had 52 bands compete in the AAAA classification at the San Antonio regional alone. I don't think you can really make the correlation you're making here. Me or principalagent? Texas also has roughly the population of Ohio, Indiana, and Illinois combined. And covers better than twice the area. Trying to compare Texas to anywhere is going to be apples-vs-oranges. Comparing Texas directly to any single state in the great lakes region (or further east/north) is more like apples-vs-pineapples.
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Post by paddy on Jun 29, 2020 10:48:21 GMT -6
Texas also has roughly the population of Ohio, Indiana, and Illinois combined. And covers better than twice the area. Trying to compare Texas to anywhere is going to be apples-vs-oranges. Comparing Texas directly to any single state in the great lakes region (or further east/north) is more like apples-vs-pineapples. Yep. Exactly what I was trying to frame by providing the information I did.
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Post by marimba11 on Jun 29, 2020 11:04:56 GMT -6
Texas also has roughly the population of Ohio, Indiana, and Illinois combined. And covers better than twice the area. Trying to compare Texas to anywhere is going to be apples-vs-oranges. Comparing Texas directly to any single state in the great lakes region (or further east/north) is more like apples-vs-pineapples. Haha. yes
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Post by secret on Jun 29, 2020 13:31:10 GMT -6
Concert band is what happens in class. Marching band is extra-curricular. At least that’s how most schools up here roll. This. Concert band is an all-year thing that doesn't get put on hold because marching band is also happening. It heavily depends on the school. Many schools DO put concert band on hold because of marching band. And with marching band rehearsals after school, there is virtually no time for after school concert band rehearsals.
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Post by drumcorpsgeek on Jun 29, 2020 13:43:55 GMT -6
PASIC 2020 in person has been cancelled.
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Post by dbalash on Jun 29, 2020 14:04:21 GMT -6
PASIC 2020 in person has been cancelled. ...which coincides with Nationals.
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Post by marimba11 on Jun 29, 2020 14:05:54 GMT -6
PASIC 2020 in person has been cancelled. Yikes
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Post by Allohak on Jun 29, 2020 15:02:26 GMT -6
PASIC 2020 in person has been cancelled. ...which coincides with Nationals. In a building directly connected to LOS
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Post by Jake W. on Jun 29, 2020 15:14:31 GMT -6
...which coincides with Nationals. I posted this on the previous page of this thread, but even if GN does happen, I think we can all safely assume at this point that it will not include any bands who need to stay overnight, which would really make it more of an Indy Regional, but it is what it is. Whether marching band & BOA happen at the local level remains to be seen at this point, but there's no way in hell any district in the country is going to approve an overnight trip for 200+ students just four short months from now. It ain't happening.
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Post by dbalash on Jun 29, 2020 15:25:25 GMT -6
What makes me laugh is the fact that USBands, which has been really poorly run for years, beat BOA to the punch and created virtual competitions. In addition, no where on the physical website is mention made (yet) of either the 5 minute minimum requirement or the fact that they're still planning on going through with the season.
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Post by OldSchoolTrumpet on Jun 29, 2020 15:49:26 GMT -6
...which coincides with Nationals. I posted this on the previous page of this thread, but even if GN does happen, I think we can all safely assume at this point that it will not include any bands who need to stay overnight, which would really make it more of an Indy Regional, but it is what it is. Whether marching band & BOA happen at the local level remains to be seen at this point, but there's no way in hell any district in the country is going to approve an overnight trip for 200+ students just four short months from now. It ain't happening. My prediction is that ultimately the entire schedule will be scrapped. I see no way these competitions can take place. I understand why they have not yet made that call, but they will eventually.
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Post by angelee on Jun 29, 2020 16:13:40 GMT -6
I posted this on the previous page of this thread, but even if GN does happen, I think we can all safely assume at this point that it will not include any bands who need to stay overnight, which would really make it more of an Indy Regional, but it is what it is. Whether marching band & BOA happen at the local level remains to be seen at this point, but there's no way in hell any district in the country is going to approve an overnight trip for 200+ students just four short months from now. It ain't happening. My prediction is that ultimately the entire schedule will be scrapped. I see no way these competitions can take place. I understand why they have not yet made that call, but they will eventually. I hate to agree with you, but I have a feeling you’re right. My son is to start band camp in 4 weeks. We are still waiting for his immediate instructor to let us know when we can start private lessons (my son is special needs and really doesn’t play his instrument so the instructor was going to help him at least be able to play big hits or something). His instructor is waiting on the “go” from the district to start with my son. Which we do not have yet. 😬
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Post by thefourth on Jun 29, 2020 17:42:04 GMT -6
What makes me laugh is the fact that USBands, which has been really poorly run for years, beat BOA to the punch and created virtual competitions. In addition, no where on the physical website is mention made (yet) of either the 5 minute minimum requirement or the fact that they're still planning on going through with the season. Reading through their proposal for virtual competitions, it sounds like a great idea! While not providing the full experience, it will give bands who are able to practice something to work towards to so there isn't just a year of no marching what so ever. I hope BOA will do something like this soon, because how everything is going in the US, unless it magically disappears(I WISH) the prospect of in-person BOA is unlikely.
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Post by Allohak on Jun 29, 2020 18:32:54 GMT -6
We have a Zoom meeting tomorrow for event staff to discuss some things. I unfortunately expect to hear that the season won't be able to happen. But we shall see and que sera, sera.
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Post by marimba11 on Jun 29, 2020 19:56:28 GMT -6
We have a Zoom meeting tomorrow for event staff to discuss some things. I unfortunately expect to hear that the season won't be able to happen. But we shall see and que sera, sera. Please let us know your findings. What is a virtual competition?
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Post by dbalash on Jun 29, 2020 20:06:40 GMT -6
We have a Zoom meeting tomorrow for event staff to discuss some things. I unfortunately expect to hear that the season won't be able to happen. But we shall see and que sera, sera. Please let us know your findings. What is a virtual competition? yea.org/news/new-virtual-performance-option-announced
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Post by marimba11 on Jun 30, 2020 6:31:11 GMT -6
At least they’re doing something
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Post by marimba11 on Jun 30, 2020 6:31:28 GMT -6
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Post by hewhowaits on Jun 30, 2020 6:57:34 GMT -6
The recognition of the importance of social interaction in the education environment was always one of the arguments against home schooling for younger children until the development of the concept of cohorts. The main reason for the recommendation seems to be the required structure that is absent for many students with remote learning.
SCHOOL happening as usual (for learning) doesn't mean that ALL aspects of the school experience will be treated the same way.
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Post by marimba11 on Jun 30, 2020 7:13:52 GMT -6
The recognition of the importance of social interaction in the education environment was always one of the arguments against home schooling for younger children until the development of the concept of cohorts. The main reason for the recommendation seems to be the required structure that is absent for many students with remote learning. SCHOOL happening as usual (for learning) doesn't mean that ALL aspects of the school experience will be treated the same way. Right, I can buy that, they're probably not going to get it all back and I'm afraid band would probably be the first to get cut in some way as we all fear. But any school is better than none. I'd say many on here probably liked their public school education (myself included) that could not have been replicated at home (at any stretch). I see these families who do the home school thing and I think it takes a certain kind of parent. Mind you many of the parents who do the homeschool thing do it because they want to keep their kids away from drugs and they think the schools indoctrinate their kids with a certain political message ect. I largely think these are not good enough reasons IMO. My mom was a teacher so I may have a bias. Yet even if they're drugs, even if the teachers have bias: oh well, you're going to have to work with people with other opinions, such is life. The social aspect of school and band is the LIFELINE for so many students at school. In band largely it is another family, and that is not an exaggeration. Should be interesting to see how it all shakes out.
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Post by angelee on Jun 30, 2020 7:37:51 GMT -6
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