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Post by principalagent on Nov 15, 2019 21:36:53 GMT -6
So question... it is possible for Miamisburg to have had a lower score than say Panther Creek? Nope. |
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Post by Allohak on Nov 15, 2019 21:43:05 GMT -6
So question... it is possible for Miamisburg to have had a lower score than say Panther Creek? Since they were on separate panels No, because Miamisburg is in the Top 22 and Panther Creek is in the 23-30 group |
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Post by indianabandfan on Nov 15, 2019 21:43:54 GMT -6
So question... it is possible for Miamisburg to have had a lower score than say Panther Creek? Nope. I think it is possible because if the scores of the top 11 in Panther Creek's panel were much higher than Miamisburg's panel, Miamisburg could have made it into the top 22 (top 11 of their panel) even though Panther Creek theoretically had the higher score and couldn't make the top 11 of the harder panel. |
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Post by principalagent on Nov 15, 2019 21:46:30 GMT -6
I think it is possible because if the scores of the top 11 in Panther Creek's panel were much higher than Miamisburg's panel, Miamisburg could have made it into the top 22 (top 11 of their panel) even though Panther Creek theoretically had the higher score and couldn't make the top 11 of the harder panel. Scroll up—Allohak and I explained this—the advancement and the scheduling are slightly different. |
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Post by srv1084 on Nov 15, 2019 21:47:10 GMT -6
I think it is possible because if the scores of the top 11 in Panther Creek's panel were much higher than Miamisburg's panel, Miamisburg could have made it into the top 22 (top 11 of their panel) even though Panther Creek theoretically had the higher score and couldn't make the top 11 of the harder panel. It's not possible. Being in the "middle 22" means you scored one of the highest 22 scores. Miamisburg is in that middle 22, Panther Creek is not. |
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Post by srv1084 on Nov 15, 2019 21:48:34 GMT -6
This is correct. They put the top 22 overall in those spots, not necessarily both top 11s. They do take the top 11 from both panels. Brownsburg and Miamisburg are the other 2 in the top 11 from panel 1. Brownsburg and Miamisburg were on panel 2, as far as I know. In addition to the 9 from panel 1 that appear in the "top 22 scores," you have the following that advanced on score: Lake Hamilton, PCEP, Panther Creek, and Lakota West. Two of those four bands placed in the top 11 of their day in addition to those 9, but we have no way of knowing which two. The other two of those four were part of the "next 8 highest scores" that advanced regardless of panel. |
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Post by hewhowaits on Nov 15, 2019 21:49:19 GMT -6
I think it is possible because if the scores of the top 11 in Panther Creek's panel were much higher than Miamisburg's panel, Miamisburg could have made it into the top 22 (top 11 of their panel) even though Panther Creek theoretically had the higher score and couldn't make the top 11 of the harder panel. Again - the "middle 22" is NOT the top 11 from each panel. It is the 22 best scores, regardless of panel. It is possible (but extremely unlikely) for the "middle 22" to be 19 bands from one panel and 3 from the other. In this case the "outside 8" would all be from the other panel. |
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Post by marimba11 on Nov 15, 2019 21:49:53 GMT -6
I think it is possible because if the scores of the top 11 in Panther Creek's panel were much higher than Miamisburg's panel, Miamisburg could have made it into the top 22 (top 11 of their panel) even though Panther Creek theoretically had the higher score and couldn't make the top 11 of the harder panel. Scroll up—Allohak and I explained this—the advancement and the scheduling are slightly different. Ahh ok got it thank you |
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Post by indianabandfan on Nov 15, 2019 21:50:27 GMT -6
I think it is possible because if the scores of the top 11 in Panther Creek's panel were much higher than Miamisburg's panel, Miamisburg could have made it into the top 22 (top 11 of their panel) even though Panther Creek theoretically had the higher score and couldn't make the top 11 of the harder panel. Scroll up—Allohak and I explained this—the advancement and the scheduling are slightly different. In 2017 prelims, O'Fallon beat fishers (opposite panels) by about 3 points. Fishers was in the top 11 of their panel, but O'Fallon was in the next 8 because O'Fallon's panel was so much more difficult than Fishers that year. |
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Post by principalagent on Nov 15, 2019 21:51:39 GMT -6
Scroll up—Allohak and I explained this—the advancement and the scheduling are slightly different. In 2017 prelims, O'Fallon beat fishers (opposite panels) by about 3 points. Fishers was in the top 11 of their panel, but O'Fallon was in the next 8 because O'Fallon's panel was so much more difficult than Fishers that year. OTHS was definitely not next 8 in 2017. |
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Post by Allohak on Nov 15, 2019 21:52:04 GMT -6
Scroll up—Allohak and I explained this—the advancement and the scheduling are slightly different. In 2017 prelims, O'Fallon beat fishers (opposite panels) by about 3 points. Fishers was in the top 11 of their panel, but O'Fallon was in the next 8 because O'Fallon's panel was so much more difficult than Fishers that year. Maybe, but O'Fallon was part of the top 22 overall and performed in the middle group while Fishers was in the outside 8. I know, it's SUPER complicated. |
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Post by srv1084 on Nov 15, 2019 21:52:11 GMT -6
Class AA is a bit unexpected. Right now you have Marian Catholic and Miamisburg as the top two Class AA bands. Jenison, Lake Hamilton, and North Hardin are fighting for 3rd as they are all part of the "Next 8" scores. Very interesting.
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Post by oldbandgeek on Nov 15, 2019 21:52:54 GMT -6
So, if I'm reading right, all 4 1A bands did not make semis on score?
(Dont forget, this is my first Nationals:-)
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Post by Allohak on Nov 15, 2019 21:53:35 GMT -6
So, if I'm reading right, all 4 1A bands did not make semis on score? (Dont forget, this is my first Nationals:-) Correct |
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Post by principalagent on Nov 15, 2019 21:53:37 GMT -6
So, if I'm reading right, all 4 1A bands did not make semis on score? (Dont forget, this is my first Nationals:-) Yep, exactly! |
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Post by indianabandfan on Nov 15, 2019 21:53:53 GMT -6
In 2017 prelims, O'Fallon beat fishers (opposite panels) by about 3 points. Fishers was in the top 11 of their panel, but O'Fallon was in the next 8 because O'Fallon's panel was so much more difficult than Fishers that year. Maybe, but O'Fallon was part of the top 22 overall and performed in the middle group while Fishers was in the outside 8. I know, it's SUPER complicated. Got it. The middle 22 performance order isn't necessarily the top 11 from each panel. Thanks for clarifying |
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Post by hewhowaits on Nov 15, 2019 22:01:38 GMT -6
Panel 1 Class AAAA
Ayala
Centerville
Hebron
Homestead
Lakota West
Panther Creek
Plymouth-Canton
Rockford
The Woodlands
Union
Vandegrift
Panel 1 Class AAA
James Madison (class advancer)
Leander
Panel 1 Class AA
Greenfield Central (class advancer)
Lake Hamilton
Panel 1 Class A
Estill County (class advancer)
Norton (class advancer)
Panel 2 Class AAAA
Avon
Ben Davis
Brownsburg
Carmel
Claudia Taylor Johnson
Fishers
Forest Hills
Harrison
James F. Byrnes
Lawrence Township
Park Vista
Round Rock
William Mason
Panel 2 Class AAA
Chattahoochee (class advancer)
Milford (class advancer)
Panel 2 Class AA
Jenison
Marian Catholic
Miamisburg
North Hardin
Panel 2 Class A
Beechwood (class advancer)
Bourbon County (class advancer)
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Post by srv1084 on Nov 15, 2019 22:40:31 GMT -6
Class AA is a bit unexpected. Right now you have Marian Catholic and Miamisburg as the top two Class AA bands. Jenison, Lake Hamilton, and North Hardin are fighting for 3rd as they are all part of the "Next 8" scores. Very interesting. I feel very different. North Hardin is definitely fighting for first. They took over AA at Indy Regional, but Marian our on their best performance of the season tonight. North Hardin could definitely win AA. The only reason Miamisburg is in the top 22 is because they had the easy panel. If NH were in that panel, it could’ve easily been them. It will definitely be close but I feel like Jenison was gonna get 3rd in their class, but now I’m leaning - North Hardin Marian Catholic Miamisburg North Hardin has the power and the design if they could just practice what they normally do - their best. Marian Catholic could really take GE, but musically it doesn’t fit and visually it doesn’t feel like they extend past the 35 yard lines. But you never know, Marian Catholic has the design, and they (might have) beat NH in their prelims panel. Marian Catholic had a wonderful performance, and North Hardin had a wack one. It happens to the best. I like to see things change, that’s why I DONT want to see Avon, Marian Catholic, or Carmel winning any titles this year. I loose interest when the same bands always win What is this easy panel/hard panel nonsense I've been reading the past few pages? I don't understand. If there was such a thing as an easy panel/hard panel, that's a moot point. Marian Catholic, Miamisburg, North Hardin, and Jenison were on the same panel. My observation was based on the way they finished after prelims, which was Marian and Miamisburg in the top 2 spots. Certainly, anything can happen, but it's not a case of "might have" beaten North Hardin in prelims. They did beat them in prelims. |
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Post by dragbot on Nov 15, 2019 22:40:43 GMT -6
Not really sure how to feel about Park Vista, but I feel that they may have been overhyped-- mostly it's their ensemble sound that leaves a lot to be desired. Park Vista overhyped? Really? They were within a point and a half from a very clean Wando in Orlando and this show is well designed and executed. They move well and move most of the show. Very clean and well trained! The transitions are amazing and the voice is one of the best I have every heard in a show. Probably the top 3 in percussion out there. Michael Gaines has written their show for the past two years. Their pit instructor was SVG director last year. Their director is on Crowns staff, their visual is the Cadets caption head next year, Their color guard head is the head for The Cadets next year, Drum line head is the head of the Academy.....Super talented staff and kids. I think compared to Carmel the show concept and design is one of the best out there. I would put them in the top 8-10. Overhyped? No...Under rated....YES!!!! |
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Post by marimba11 on Nov 15, 2019 22:47:57 GMT -6
Not really sure how to feel about Park Vista, but I feel that they may have been overhyped-- mostly it's their ensemble sound that leaves a lot to be desired. Park Vista overhyped? Really? They were within a point and a half from a very clean Wando in Orlando and this show is well designed and executed. They move well and move most of the show. Very clean and well trained! The transitions are amazing and the voice is one of the best I have every heard in a show. Probably the top 3 in percussion out there. Michael Gaines has written their show for the past two years. Their pit instructor was SVG director last year. Their director is on Crowns staff, their visual is the Cadets caption head next year, Their color guard head is the head for The Cadets next year, Drum line head is the head of the Academy.....Super talented staff and kids. I think compared to Carmel the show concept and design is one of the best out there. I would put them in the top 8-10. Overhyped? No...Under rated....YES!!!! Wando was quite dirty at Orlando actually. They really cleaned up for state (as I expected they would) - which their show was written for. Honestly a staff full of DCI people really doesn’t always pan out the way some would think but that’s another conversation for another time. Yes they are very qualified. With that said Park Vista can make finals. Let’s see what happens. |
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Post by dallasman on Nov 15, 2019 23:49:26 GMT -6
I feel very different. North Hardin is definitely fighting for first. They took over AA at Indy Regional, but Marian our on their best performance of the season tonight. North Hardin could definitely win AA. The only reason Miamisburg is in the top 22 is because they had the easy panel. If NH were in that panel, it could’ve easily been them. It will definitely be close but I feel like Jenison was gonna get 3rd in their class, but now I’m leaning - North Hardin Marian Catholic Miamisburg North Hardin has the power and the design if they could just practice what they normally do - their best. Marian Catholic could really take GE, but musically it doesn’t fit and visually it doesn’t feel like they extend past the 35 yard lines. But you never know, Marian Catholic has the design, and they (might have) beat NH in their prelims panel. Marian Catholic had a wonderful performance, and Northin had a wack one. It happens to the best. I like to see things change, that’s why I DONT want to see Avon, Marian Catholic, or Carmel winning any titles this year. I loose interest when the same bands always win No, North Hardin does not have the power and design that Marian does — at full power and performance. That said, Marian can’t simply show up and expect to win anything without an excellent performance. North Hardin is having a really good year (and we’ll see what happens), but they and Marian were in a photo finish weeks ago. Marian simply had much more work to do and growth potential. You don’t want the same bands to win, but they doesn’t mean that the same bands are not deserving. |
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Post by greyhound on Nov 16, 2019 1:15:42 GMT -6
Class AA is a bit unexpected. Right now you have Marian Catholic and Miamisburg as the top two Class AA bands. Jenison, Lake Hamilton, and North Hardin are fighting for 3rd as they are all part of the "Next 8" scores. Very interesting. I feel very different. North Hardin is definitely fighting for first. They took over AA at Indy Regional, but Marian our on their best performance of the season tonight. North Hardin could definitely win AA. The only reason Miamisburg is in the top 22 is because they had the easy panel. If NH were in that panel, it could’ve easily been them. It will definitely be close but I feel like Jenison was gonna get 3rd in their class, but now I’m leaning - North Hardin Marian Catholic Miamisburg North Hardin has the power and the design if they could just practice what they normally do - their best. Marian Catholic could really take GE, but musically it doesn’t fit and visually it doesn’t feel like they extend past the 35 yard lines. But you never know, Marian Catholic has the design, and they (might have) beat NH in their prelims panel. Marian Catholic had a wonderful performance, and North Hardin had a wack one. It happens to the best. I like to see things change, that’s why I DONT want to see Avon, Marian Catholic, or Carmel winning any titles this year. I loose interest when the same bands always win I am sorry, but I cannot help but laugh at this post. So you are essentially claiming that panel 1 is the "easy panel"? Therefore, one can then conclude that North Hardin (on panel 1) won AA at the Indy Super because they had the "easy panel"? How very insulting to any band on panel 1 across these last 2 days. Bands will place where they do on their achievements and merit. I am curious if you even watched either of Marian's performances both at the Indy Super, and this evening? If the answer is yes, then you would realize the insane cleaning that took place, both musically and visually since their last performance. Not to mention the absolutely insane level of difficulty of the music alone, which it seems they have finally gotten a handle on. Miamisburg and Marian Catholic are in the top 22, not North Hardin. Therefore, it does not look to me like North Hardin will be fighting for that top spot tomorrow. |
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Post by cinnamonpromenade on Nov 16, 2019 1:55:57 GMT -6
Not really sure how to feel about Park Vista, but I feel that they may have been overhyped-- mostly it's their ensemble sound that leaves a lot to be desired. Park Vista overhyped? Really? They were within a point and a half from a very clean Wando in Orlando and this show is well designed and executed. They move well and move most of the show. Very clean and well trained! The transitions are amazing and the voice is one of the best I have every heard in a show. Probably the top 3 in percussion out there. Michael Gaines has written their show for the past two years. Their pit instructor was SVG director last year. Their director is on Crowns staff, their visual is the Cadets caption head next year, Their color guard head is the head for The Cadets next year, Drum line head is the head of the Academy.....Super talented staff and kids. I think compared to Carmel the show concept and design is one of the best out there. I would put them in the top 8-10. Overhyped? No...Under rated....YES!!!! Considering how talented their entire staff is, then, how unfortunate that their show this year has not lived up to the standards of these people's work from elsewhere. All cattiness aside, this is a very bold group that will undoubtedly make finals one day should they continue on this path. Clearly evidence of high-level training and modern design strategy. Hoping they have a great final run tomorrow morning. |
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Post by Marching Observer on Nov 16, 2019 5:31:38 GMT -6
So early. *Yawn* Morning everyone. *Insert getting too old for this comment here*
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Post by mtnxdrew on Nov 16, 2019 7:02:15 GMT -6
6:15 AM — Milford H.S., OH 6:30 AM — Norton H.S., OH 6:45 AM — James Madison H.S., VA 7:00 AM — Beechwood H.S., KY 7:15 AM — Bourbon County H.S., KY 7:30 AM — Greenfield Central H.S., IN 7:45 AM — Estill County H.S., KY 8:00 AM — Chattahoochee H.S., GA 8:15 AM — Plymouth-Canton Ed. Park, MI 8:30 AM — Panther Creek H.S., NC 8:45 AM — North Hardin H.S., KY 9:00 AM — Forest Hills Schools, OH 9:15 AM — Fishers H.S., IN 9:30 AM – BREAK 10:00 AM — Miamisburg H.S., OH 10:15 AM — Marian Catholic H.S., IL 10:30 AM — Round Rock H.S., TX 10:45 AM — Homestead H.S., IN 10:00 AM — Carmel H.S., IN 11:15 AM — Park Vista H.S., FL 11:30 AM — Union H.S., OK 11:45 AM — William Mason H.S., OH 12:00 PM — Leander H.S., TX 12:15 PM — Hebron H.S., TX 12:30 PM — Centerville H.S., OH 12:45 PM — Claudia Taylor Johnson H.S., TX 1:00 PM — EXHIBITION: Missouri State University 1:15 PM – BREAK 1:30 PM — Vandegrift H.S., TX 1:45 PM — Rockford H.S., MI 2:00 PM — James F. Byrnes H.S., SC 2:15 PM — Avon H.S., IN 2:30 PM — The Woodlands H.S., TX 2:45 PM — Harrison H.S., GA 3:00 PM — Ayala H.S., CA 3:15 PM — Brownsburg H.S., IN 3:30 PM — Lawrence Township, IN 3:45 PM — Jenison H.S., MI 4:00 PM — Lakota West H.S., OH 4:15 PM — Lake Hamilton H.S., AR 4:30 PM — Ben Davis H.S., IN 4:45 PM — EXHIBITION: Texas A&M Univ. – Commerce What’s everyone’s thought on the fact that Miamisburg, North Hardin, and Jenison could be 22-24 coming out of prelims. Sets up quite the battle behind Marian in AA |
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Post by bandaid on Nov 16, 2019 7:13:47 GMT -6
In Solidarity with these band kids and parents having to be up before it's "time to make the donuts" I too am up early!! GO BAND!!
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Post by pocobill on Nov 16, 2019 8:02:12 GMT -6
Spent 28 years with a small (not in heart) band, I was totally amazed by several of the A and AA bands came with in GN.
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Post by dragbot on Nov 16, 2019 8:58:04 GMT -6
Park Vista overhyped? Really? They were within a point and a half from a very clean Wando in Orlando and this show is well designed and executed. They move well and move most of the show. Very clean and well trained! The transitions are amazing and the voice is one of the best I have every heard in a show. Probably the top 3 in percussion out there. Michael Gaines has written their show for the past two years. Their pit instructor was SVG director last year. Their director is on Crowns staff, their visual is the Cadets caption head next year, Their color guard head is the head for The Cadets next year, Drum line head is the head of the Academy.....Super talented staff and kids. I think compared to Carmel the show concept and design is one of the best out there. I would put them in the top 8-10. Overhyped? No...Under rated....YES!!!! Considering how talented their entire staff is, then, how unfortunate that their show this year has not lived up to the standards of these people's work from elsewhere. All cattiness aside, this is a very bold group that will undoubtedly make finals one day should they continue on this path. Clearly evidence of high-level training and modern design strategy. Hoping they have a great final run tomorrow morning. Are you serious? Their show rocks. Michael Gaines is a brilliant show designer, actually the best in the world. What standards are you talking about? I have been in this activity for over 30 years and your post does not make sense. No cattiness, just calling you out on your opinion of 5 year in a row top 32 Horn ranked band. Their horn line is powerful and DCI like lower brass! PVP will make finals. Bet on it! |
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Post by cornet on Nov 16, 2019 9:50:00 GMT -6
It’s weird that Panther Creek lost to James Madison by several points at BOA Virginia and now Panther Creek is the one in the next 8 not Madison. Guess that’s how it goes. Not weird to me. When I watched them at Lynchburg I remarked that I thought they had a very high achievement to demand ratio compared to their peer group and it creates a dilemma for judges. So first, maybe those judges saw the dilemma differently and secondly the bands with higher demand probably closed the achievement gap. I'm sure it was close. |
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Post by cinnamonpromenade on Nov 16, 2019 10:05:47 GMT -6
Considering how talented their entire staff is, then, how unfortunate that their show this year has not lived up to the standards of these people's work from elsewhere. All cattiness aside, this is a very bold group that will undoubtedly make finals one day should they continue on this path. Clearly evidence of high-level training and modern design strategy. Hoping they have a great final run tomorrow morning. Are you serious? Their show rocks. Michael Gaines is a brilliant show designer, actually the best in the world. What standards are you talking about? I have been in this activity for over 30 years and your post does not make sense. No cattiness, just calling you out on your opinion of 5 year in a row top 32 Horn ranked band. Their horn line is powerful and DCI like lower brass! PVP will make finals. Bet on it! If you’ve been in this activity for 30 years, then you’d understand that the pacing of their show feels awkward, that it’s questionable to take ~45 seconds to pull the tarps together in the last third of the show (with no intention as to WHY they pull together, nor any event/resolution when they finally arrive in their... lotus flower[??] form), and that their winds (particularly the brass) do not play with enough balance or blend to justify a finals berth. I assessed Thursday night’s run based on how they performed that night—with no bias based on their staff or history—and unless if that run was an extreme anomaly, then I agree with others that their show has been overhyped. I would love to be proven wrong in 10 minutes. Best of luck to them! |
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